female podcast

Joy: I don’t even know how to start this episode. I was really hesitant to be chipper because I had this feeling yesterday where I’m like, I think I’m in a midlife crisis, and I don’t know how to talk about it.

Claire: I don’t know what I thought you were about to say, but that is not it.

Joy: That’s not it?

Claire: Okay, let’s pause. Let’s give a little context into the last ten days of your life. When we last left our heroes, Joy and Claire, you had not even gone to Cadet’s graduation yet.

Joy: No. No.

Claire: You’ve been through a lot.

Joy: Been through a lot since the last recording. This is why I hate recording in advance when there’s a lot going on. So many reasons. Because so much happens, and when I listen to the episode, I’m like oh my gosh, so much has happened, this is old news. You can probably tell by my voice that I’m getting over something. I did have Covid, so that’s a fun news alert. Where do I begin? Where do we want to start?

Claire: Claire and Joy finally got Covid. That’s a good place to start. I wonder if this is how it feels for the Great British Baking contestants when they know how the season ends and we’re all freaking out about who goes home in week one. Old news, old news.

Joy: Yeah, that’s so true.

Claire: Pretty much the same. We’re pretty much the Baking Show.

Joy: I was over it. I was over it. Well… I don’t even know where to begin, but I will start with Cadet’s graduation. Alright. So we go to her graduation on Thursday. We leave Thursday, June 9. We get there. I’m so excited. It’s just the most amazing feeling of being able to be reunited with her. We had the agenda. They were like, get there at 9. You’re going to meet the graduate. You’ll have an hour with the graduate, and then you’ll have an hour with your dog separately. Then the graduation ceremony. So we were prepared for that. Scott wasn’t feeling great, but he tested every single day, and it was negative. We think it was allergies because we have two huge cottonwood trees in our backyard. Not to mention the neighborhood has a bunch of cottonwood trees. It’s a horrible time of year. It just looks like snow. It looks like snow is coming down from the sky because there is so much cottonwood in the air. So we’re chalking it up to allergies. Fine, fine, fine. And he’s worried because he’s like, “If this turns into Covid, I’m not going to go to graduation.” I’m willing this to not be Covid. And by the way, it was not Covid. So we thought. You can only test so many times. He tested every single day, sometimes twice a day because we were so worried about going to this graduation. We were wearing masks and clear face shields the whole time because the graduates need to lip read. So we had clear face shields. It was all protected. So he was able to go, spoiler alert. We were just worried the whole time he was sick. And I was worried, “Oh my gosh, I need to go to this wedding in two days.” So it starts out a little bit stressful. Bless Scott, but when he’s sick, he’s insufferable to be around. He’s just constantly – is Brandon like that?

Claire: You know that he is.

Joy: I mean, I know he stuffs tissues up his nose.

Claire: I mean, yeah, that’s really just indicative of the whole thing. If you’re new here and did not know this about my husband, any time he has a stuffy nose or is the least bit sick, takes wads of toilet paper, shoves them up his nostrils, and walks around the house with a blanket over his head moaning. Any time he’s sick. I’m like, if you’re going to suffer, can you go do it in the other room?

Joy: Do you have to be the ghost of whining, the ghost of illness?

Claire: Right. Do you have to be like the ghost of husbands past?

Joy: You might as well give him chains to shake around the house and be like [moaning].

Claire: Right. It was so great though. The other day, he did that. He had allergies, and he had these snot rags in. He walks out. And Evie had said she wanted to read a book, I think. Brandon was like, “Okay, hold on.” He goes into the bathroom to shove the toilet paper in his nose. And Evie goes, “Take that out.” I was like, “I agree Evie.” Brandon was like, “Come on, Evie. It’s time to read.” And she was like, “No, take that out.” He listens to her. I was like, yes. Evie is in control. She knows what’s up. Yes, he is insufferable. He tries not to be. He’s gotten better.

Joy: Okay. Scott has not. He just gets very whiny when he’s sick, I don’t know. Anyway. It started out kind of stressful because I was worried about that. But we got there, and I feel great. He was still kind of feeling so-so. We get there and our room wasn’t ready, so we had to wait a long time. The battery on my phone was dying, and I had food that I wanted to eat in the room. So the whole beginning of the day, we were just fighting and gripey with each other. I just wanted to go in the hotel room and sit and eat my meal. But it was a great hotel, by the way. The Seabird, it was wonderful. If anyone goes to Oceanside, it’s the cutest hotel. And they were really nice and gave us some upgrades because they didn’t have our room ready for like five hours later than we had checked in. So the graduation morning, we get there and we meet with the Canine Companions graduate coordinator. It’s so good to see people in person. A lot of these people remember graduated with a Canine Companions dog, so I knew a lot of the people going into this. Seeing them face-to-face – actually, it was a little bit bittersweet because flying in all I could think of was, the last time I was here we were turning Cadet in. So it was a little bit bittersweet, but it was so good to see a lot of familiar faces in person. So they gave us the rundown about the graduates and what to expect. So we walk in and we meet Amber, his graduate. Immediately – I don’t know why, but immediately she was not at all what I was expecting. I didn’t know what to expect, but she’s not at all what I expected. It was just like, oh my gosh, you’re not at all what I was expecting. She was so sweet. We immediately sat down and talked for like an hour. I was nervous. I think I had nervous energy because it was the most surreal feeling in the world to be there. I think I had a bazillion emotions going on because I was nostalgic for Canine Companions, which just has a special place in my heart from the history I have there with JT, turning in Cadet and having that memory, and then all of the sudden the overwhelm of being there. And we were with seven other teams. There were other people there that were meeting their dog. Everyone was just nervous excitement. I remember sitting down. We brought the baby book I’d made with all the photos of Cadet when she was younger. We brought Cadet’s favorite toys when we were raising her. So immediately instead of giving her the bag, I just start opening everything in the bag. I was like, “Here. Here are some things that we brought you.” So I open the baby book and just start going through the pictures and immediately start crying. It was so weird. I don’t know why I think that I’m going to be able to hold it together, but the entire time, I’m fine. Totally fine. People are talking to me about Cadet’s graduation. And I’m detached because it’s been six months since we’ve seen her. So I’m totally cool as a cucumber. “Yeah, it’s great. We’re going to see her graduate. She’s going to be a hearing dog. Wonderful.” This is the joke that I play on myself. This is where last year when I was turning her in, I kept saying “feel your feelings” because what I tend to do is stuff them down, and I’m like,” It’s going to be fine. It’s going to be great. It’s just a transaction, and no one is going to cry.” That did not happen. So immediately going through the baby book, I start bawling my eyes out. And I feel kind of dumb because you don’t want the graduate to feel bad. You don’t want the graduate to know be like, “Um, you know…”

Claire: I’m stealing your dog… sorry.

Joy: And I was not crying from that place where I was devastated and heartbroken. I was just more like, oh my gosh, just a happy…

Claire: It was more… what’s that word?

Joy: Emotionally?

Claire: Nostalgic.

Joy: Oh, super nostalgic. And then I got to the picture – anyway. I can’t talk about it. And I’m going to cry. Fuck.

Claire: I will say by the way, I don’t think you were playing it as cool as you think you were going up to it. Maybe you thought you were imagining that you were projecting this cool as a cucumber, “Oh yeah, I’m just going to meet her and hand her off.” But, uh… I mean, you didn’t get that emotional. But I feel like every time you talked about it, there was this kind of nervous energy about it a little bit.

Joy: So going through the baby book and I start crying. I’m like, “Dang it, I’m sorry. I didn’t mean to start crying.” I kind of apologize because I don’t want her to feel uncomfortable. But she was just so, so sweet. We had a lovely conversation. She talked about what led her to get to CCI and match with a dog and her expectations of what she thought she wanted in a dog and when she met Cadet. It was lovely. And then [tearing up]. Ah, fuck… ugh, feel your feelings. I’m so pissed that I’m still crying over this. I have to go back to work today. [pause] They put you in a room, and they’re like, “We’re going to bring your dog out.” And then I hear her name, and she comes up to us, and she’s cute and happy and smiley. I posted the video. She recognized us, and she ran up to us, but it was so clear that she wasn’t our dog anymore. And that was like… Sandy put it this way. Because I kept saying it was like a boyfriend that you have to let go of. She’s like, “It’s actually more like when you marry someone off, a daughter or a son.” And you have this very heartbroken feeling. You’ve spent your whole life with them, and then they’re gone. I immediately thought of Father of the Bride when Steve Martin is like, “Oh, it’s not my little girl anymore” and she gets married off. I don’t know how it feels to marry off a child. And you know how I feel about comparing children to animals, but that’s the closest thing I could think of. Because everyone is like, “Oh, did she recognize you?” And even the trainers are like, “They’ll recognize you, but” – and she did. But I was like, oh, and she’s moved on.

Claire: Did they tell you that that was going to happen?

Joy: No, no, no, they don’t tell you. And I don’t think people are analyzing it as much as I innately knew. She’s playing with us and being Cadet.

Claire: Right. She’s excited to see you, but she’s not like, “Oh my gosh, you finally came back for me.”

Joy: No. Which I think would be worse.

Claire: It would be worse. I completely agree with you. It would be so much worse.

Joy: I think it would be so much worse. But I didn’t expect that. And I didn’t get all these emotions I think until after we left. But it was really hard because you’re so happy, but also you’re like, she’s gone. The finality of it was really hard because she was gone, meaning she’s moved on. And throughout the whole training, you kind of see her progress and you know she’s still in training, so you’re still kind of the point person for her. You’re not the owner per se, but you’re the point person for her.

Claire: Right. You’re the emergency contact.

Joy: Yes.

Claire: You’re still getting her reports. You’re still the person they call if something goes wrong.

Joy: Yeah. And so that’s kind of where it’s like, she’s a graduate. She’s a graduate dog. She was amazing, and she was so sweet and so loving. But that’s where I was like, she’s not ours. I want to be clear, it’s not like I was mad about it, but it just kind of breaks your heart at the same time. So we got to spend an hour with her. We took a bunch of pictures, and it was great. Then we do graduation. I think the coolest part for me – I mean, I cried through the whole graduation because it was so cool to just see how these dogs are going to change people’s lives. I think the coolest part was when – so people who watched it, you may have seen on the left side all the puppy raisers sat, and then on the right side all the graduates sat. And the puppy raisers and the graduates would meet in the middle, and the puppy raisers would turn the dog over to the graduate and pass the leash, so to speak, is the ceremony that they’ve done over the years. And they do this with every graduate. Service dog, hearing dog, whatever. The thing that I noticed is all the service dogs with the puppy raisers, when we were sitting on the left side, all the dogs were really squirrelly, and they were moving around. We noticed Cadet was walking around a lot and rubbing up against me. They kind of had this weird nervous energy. Not in a bad way, but I definitely noticed it. And the second they got turned over to their graduate, the dogs were just passed out asleep next to their person. I just remember thinking, oh my gosh, it’s perfect. Everyone has their match, and they’re comfortable and they’re settled. It was so cool. It was so cool to see. She was very in tune with Amber. The second Amber would walk by, Cadet’s head would perk up and she would watch her. It was amazing. But that was so hard to leave. And her family was so generous. They were like, “Any time you want to come stay with us, you can stay in our house.” Amber’s parents were there. They were so kind because they’re considered local. They’re only an hour away from Oceanside. So her parents were inviting us to stay with them. And they really meant it. They were so genuine. Her grandpa was giving me a hug, and her grandma was so excited and really spunky and said something funny that I can’t remember. She just made me laugh. It was all-in-all, that was so beyond perfect. It was emotionally so hard to just all of the sudden go on an airplane and fly to Arizona and then go to a wedding that weekend. I don’t think I would have done it like that ever again. Next time, don’t plan back-to-back trips. Not only that, Scott decided to stay home. For a number of reasons. Mainly managing all of our pets and the house and his work schedule. I’m like, “I’ll go to the wedding. It’s fine. I’m going to go to Arizona. You just please hold down the fort.”

Claire: So not stay home. He flew home from the graduation.

Joy: Sorry. Yeah, he flew home from the graduation, and I flew to Arizona. So we had this split up at the airport, which I could not emotionally handle either. The second he’s like, “Alright, you’ve got to go on this bus, and I…” All of the sudden being alone without him also made me cry. So I was just in the worst spot, and I just started… I think I posted about this. You have to laugh at some point when you’re just so emotional. He was flying United. I was flying Southwest. I remember talking about the San Diego airport in a recent trip we did or last year. I was like, “Oh my gosh, I love it.” No, I don’t. I take it back. I think the last time we flew, it was totally empty and not an issue. But I take back what I said. I do not love the San Diego airport. What happened was, I go through security and it is so busy. Just packed. Nobody is wearing a mask. I am wearing a mask the entire time I’m traveling, by the way. I couldn’t find a place to sit. I’m emotionally wrecked. Just so wrecked. So I can’t find a place to sit. I’m wanting to just sit in the middle of a restaurant and cry and drink myself silly because I don’t know what else to do. Oh, and my phone is dying. There’s no plugs anywhere because it’s that situation where everyone is sitting near a plug. People are sitting on the ground. Not one space to sit. I then think, I’m going to go look for some food. In my delirium, I start walking towards some other – it says, oh, you’re going to go to this gate. And part of me is like, this is closer to the gate where I’m flying out of. So I turn this corner, which basically just spit me back out into baggage claim. I am all of the sudden not near any gates or food. I’m back out near baggage claim.

Claire: Did you have to go through security again?

Joy: Oh yeah, I did. But here’s the kicker. I was in the wrong terminal. Southwest has two terminals, and I just wasn’t paying attention. The guy who was checking and saying this is B10 to whatever… I wasn’t listening. Because I was just, again, not in my right mind. I was like, screw this. I’ve got to go get some food. Got some food, sat and ate. And then I look up at the TV and it says your flight it delayed. And I cannot. It said 10 minutes. I said, 10 minutes I can do.

Claire: It’s never 10 minutes.

Joy: Never.

Claire: I feel like 10 minutes must be the default that they put in before they have the details. It’s like what shows up while it’s buffering.

Joy: Totally. Or they’re like, we’re just going to give you a heads up that this flight it cancelled. We’re going to start with 10 minutes. So I look up and I’m like, ugh, it’s delayed. I see it go from 10 minutes to 30 minutes to an hour. I’m like, this ain’t good because if I’ve learned anything from Scott Parrish, the travel pro, is that they are just trying to delay the fact that the flight is going to get cancelled. I immediately start panicking. I can’t sit in this God forsaken airport one more hour and just wait for a flight while I am emotionally breaking down. You guys, I understand that this is very drama filled. This is just the reality of where I was.

Claire: I also feel like nothing is as dramatic… how am I trying to phrase this? The most dramatic feelings are felt in an airport. I feel like if you are in an airport and you are by yourself and the world is buzzing all around you –

Joy: So many things are out of your control.

Claire: I’ve told the story before of when I broke down ugly crying in the security line at LAX because the security guard took away my snow globe when I was traveling. I was in New Zealand when the 3 ounces of liquid rule happened, and I flew home with this thing in my carry one. It stupidly counted as liquid, even though it was a snow globe. They took it away, and I was sobbing because my boyfriend had broken up with me in New Zealand. And I also have spent a lot of time sobbing in the Vancouver airport in a corner. Where else? Oh, the Seattle airport. That’s when that lady came up to me and gave me a hug. I know I’ve told that story. Because a boyfriend broke up with me again. In Vancouver, I was just having a nervous breakdown because I had just been in the woods for 30 days and then I had to go to the Vancouver airport and couldn’t cope.

Joy: Airports are where a lot of things happen.

Claire: It’s a lot. There’s a lot going on. There’s a lot of feelings.

Joy: So many feelings.

Claire: And you cannot be alone. Maybe this is just people who… flying does not make me nervous inherently. Being up in the air in a metal tube, I’m fine with. But the process of flying puts me on so much edge that I feel like I’m already right at my limit just being a part of that activity. Going to an airport, I’m already at my limit.

Joy: Yeah. This is where I was like, I will do anything to be wealthy enough to have a private jet. That’s the thought that was going through my head.

Claire: One million percent.

Joy: At this point, [UNSURE 00:21:24.07] is there a 40+ accounts for OnlyFans because I’m ready.

Claire: Who wants feet pics? You can have them. I don’t think you’re going to get there through our Joy and Claire Patreon that we never activated. But hear our plea listeners. Joy and Claire need to fly private.

Joy: We will come and pick you up, I swear.

Claire: We will come and pick you up. There will be a platinum membership you can have on our plane if you donate more than like $30. That is a steal.

Joy: That is a steal. And you get to ride with us. I don’t know what else to tell you.

Claire: The problem is that we’re going to need 100,000 of you to donate.

Joy: Oh God. But that was literally going through my mind. You know what, I will do anything. I will sell and do anything to not sit – I was in such a place, guys. Where am I? What did I leave off?

Claire: Hold on. I would just like to make a callout for anyone who has a dramatic airport story. We all have the airport horror stories of things going wrong and people being horrible logistically. I am more interested in, have you experience an emotional crisis in an airport? The thing is, people travel during very tragic times in their lives. If there is an emergency in your family or someone suddenly passes away, you have to use an airport. A lot of big transitions happen right before you fly. Whether you are moving somewhere or you are leaving for college. Tell us about an interaction that you had in an airport that should have been benign but was so emotionally charged that you just broke down in tears.

Joy: Yeah. Well I’m about to tell you mine that continues. It just keeps unraveling. So I get some food, I eat. I’m eating outside of the terminal watching the delay just continue. So I’m like, well I have to eat this food before I go back through security because can’t bring the drink. I got a beverage. Can’t bring liquid. That was a dumb choice.

Claire: At that point, if they try to take your beverage, it’s going to be over.

Joy: Oh, over. So I eat my meal and go again through security. I have to throw away my beverage because I am just not in the mood to sit here and down a soda. And I wanted to get closer to the gate to see if I could get any information about how long it was going to be. If you have not yet gotten on the website, I think it’s called Flight Tracker or flight something, you can actually see where your flight is coming from. I do that all the time, just to see is the plane that I’m actually supposed to be on even leaving from where it’s coming from.

Claire: The United app has that in their –

Joy: The United app does. Southwest does not, so I had to get on Flight Tracker or whatever. So I see that it’s not leaving – I think it was Tahoe. But anyway, doesn’t matter. It wasn’t leaving. So I go through security. I go through again to see if I can get more information. I sit at a chair for a while, and that’s when I’m doing Instagram. I’m answering questions because I have all the time in the world. Then I see the flight is pushed out another hour and a half, I think. So at this point, I’m in the airport for four hours total just sitting around. With elbow to elbow, shoulder to shoulder people. Here’s where I lose it. I then realize I’m not going make this flight tonight. This flight is very at risk of being cancelled, so I’m going to try to get on another flight that’s leaving around the same time. It doesn’t matter now. This flight is leaving at 7pm. There’s another flight that’s leaving at 6:45, so I’m going to try to make the 6:45 flight. So I get to the gate agent and talk to her. We get the flight switched. So goes, “Oh actually, you have to go through the other terminal.” This is the third time I go through security. “You have to go to the other terminal because it leaves out of B2.” I’m like, okay. So I forget that while I’m sitting in that terminal, I had filled up my water bottle. I’m having a nice little drink of water by myself. Not even thinking that I have to go through security the third time, and I have water in my water bottle. I also get checked through the third time through security. I also get checked for a random scan of my electronics because I have two laptops. I need one for work and one for the podcast. So they check my electronics. And the guy is like, “Oh, you have water in here. You can either go through security again and drink it all or throw it away.” I don’t know the other option he gave me. You can either go back, empty it, throw it away, or there was a third option I don’t remember. Maybe there wasn’t.

Claire: Throw it in my face out of pure rage.

Joy: Yeah. Part of me wanted to be like, “Is there an option C where you just turn the other way?”

Claire: Right. Is there an option C where we just know this is fountain drinking water and this is the stupidest rule?

Joy: And thank goodness for TSA. This is not a TSA thing. I know they are doing their job. That is the first thing I go through my head. Every person is a terrorist in their mind. I know that I can’t fight them on this. I did not even try to, but in my mind I’m like, please just have mercy on my soul. I just have to say, I actually did start crying behind my mask. Thank goodness I had a mask on because they probably would have been like, woah, this lady is actually at risk for doing something. He starts going through my laptops. He’s checking my laptops, and he’s giving me a lecture about not carrying water through security. I did tell him, “Oh, I am so sorry. I just came from the other terminal. Totally forgot.” Normally when I come to the airport, I’m not filling up my water bottle.

Claire: I’m not an idiot. Right. I have in fact flown since 2006. Spare me your lecture.

Joy: Yes, please spare me the lecture. I am a seasoned traveler sir. I have a husband who would probably lecture me for you.

Claire: He would die of embarrassment.

Joy: He would die of embarrassment. I’m sitting there going, I was in the other terminal. I just wasn’t thinking. My brain is not even working guys. He is giving me a lecture and then he goes, “You know, next time just put ice in there.” I’m like, “Ice is water, sir.” I didn’t say this. But, ice? He goes, “You can bring in ice and just fill it up when you get past security.” I’m thinking, so not the point. I don’t care about your lecture about water. Please give me my computers.

Claire: I am not crying out of fear of dehydration.

Joy: No, no, no. And he said it probably five times to really nail home the point.

Claire: Got it. Got it. I got the ice.

Joy: “You can put ice in there, and next time you just can’t bring water through. But you can put ice in there.”

Claire: Got it.

Joy: I’m like… mamma. The guy says, “Do you want to throw it away, or do you want to keep it?” I said, “Just toss it.” Immediately regretted my decision as I watched him carry my water bottle. It was a nice, whatever those metal ones are. Nice. It’s a small one. [sigh] But we’ve had it for ages. It had a Canine Companions sticker on it, and I just thought, I’m never going to get that back. I start crying. Not in front of them, but I start crying behind my mask. I take my bags and I go up the stairs. It was ugly cry. Not even a mask will save you.

Claire: And the more you try to resist it, the more it’s bubbling up.

Joy: Totally. It’s the word vomit of cry, and I just start sobbing and tears are squirting out my eyes. People are walking towards me, totally looking at me like, “Oh no. Is she okay?” I wish someone that saw me would have given me a hug. And then I go into the bathroom, and I sit in the stall, and I just bawl. Just get it out. This is so dumb. You’re going to laugh at this one day. But you’re just so emotionally raw that you have to get emotional over losing a water bottle that you could easily replace. So finally get to Arizona, finally get to my friend’s house. We have a good laugh over me losing the water bottle. I told her the story on the drive home. I’ve never been so happy to be out of an airport and into a house and a home. So let’s take a quick break. [laughing] My story.

Claire: Let’s take a breather. We still have to hear about your midlife crisis.

Joy: Wait, you have to hear about my what?

Claire: Your midlife crisis.

Joy: Oh my gosh.

Claire: You forgot already that you opened this whole episode with you’re going through a midlife crisis.

Joy: Yeah, I’m just leaving everybody hanging. It’s probably no surprise at this point that something is going on with me.

Claire: I was about to say, maybe we should wait another week and see how you feel.

Joy: I don’t know. It’s been lingering. Maybe Ned can save me.

Claire: I know, if anyone can. So we want to tell you guys about our favorite CBD company, Ned. Ned is the maker of our favorite CBD products and also some of our other favorite botanical products or mineral products. I love their Mellow drink blend, which I take every night. As well as the Daily Blend, which is their full-spectrum hemp tincture. The way I use it is I take the CBD right after I brush my teeth. I take the mellow probably about an hour before I go to bed. So it’s like Mellow, hang out for a minute, and then CBD right before bedtime. It does taste a little skunky, but I have come to enjoy it. It just really helps calm me down. The magnesium is actually also something that my neurologist suggested for my migraines. It also helps me. I have restless legs and restless arms. Obviously, this is not medical advice. This is just the way that I use it. But a lot of people reach out to us and say, “Hey, can you tell us exactly what it is that you’re doing with it and exactly what you use to find it effective?” So that is how I love to use it. Those are my favorite products. I just got a new batch, got delivered last week. It was so exciting. When it shows up, you’re just like –

Joy: So excited.

Claire: My little allies are here.

Joy: I know. I’ve got to over mine. I’ve said this before, but the Mellow Magnesium is so helpful when you really need to feel calm. The second I drink it, I’m like [sigh].

Claire: And it tastes good. It’s this nice little ritual. Now I feel like when I start to drink the magnesium – maybe this is a placebo effect – but it feels like my body is like, okay, it’s almost bedtime. You can sort of start to chill. And it signals not just the ingredients but also the ritual of drinking it and making it tells my body, okay, it’s time to wind down.

Joy: That’s what they say about sleep is make a routine so your body gets the signal it’s sleepy time. The other thing I love is Ned has full transparency. They share their third-party lab reports, who farms their products, and their extraction process. All right there on their site. You can support the podcast, become the best version of yourself, and get 15% off Ned products with code JOY. Go to helloned.com/JOY or enter code JOY at checkout. That’s helloned.com/JOY to get 15% off. Thank you, Ned, for sponsoring the show and offering our listeners a natural remedy for some of life’s most common health issues.

Claire: Alright. So to recap the following couple of days. You went to this great wedding. It was fantastic. And then you’re feeling a little under the weather, tested for Covid just to be sure but were pretty sure you didn’t have it, and then lo and behold it’s positive.

Joy: Mmhmm.

Claire: You found your way back to Colorado as safe as you could. You have just emerged from the Covid timeframe.

Joy: Yeah, just emerged from the Covid timeframe. Which thank goodness, this is where I’m like, for the two years I have dodged Covid somehow and who knows where I got it. I don’t think it was at the wedding. It could have been at the wedding. The numbers didn’t add up as far as when I started having symptoms. It really could have been anywhere, to be honest. At this point, everything seems to be risky. And I think what really hit home for me with this experience, I just have to say, is how important it is to still be careful and get vaccinated. I am so grateful that I have the vaccine and the booster because my symptoms were pretty darn mild. I attribute it to the vaccine and the booster, but you just never know. It hits people so different. Every single person that’s had Covid has told me a different version of what they experienced. I was just grateful that my symptoms improved pretty quickly, meaning they say after day five that you’ve tested positive that if your symptoms are improving, continue to wear a mask but you can go out. I’ve just been more on the careful side of only going out if I have to grab groceries or food or something. But it was pretty darn mild. I was just terrified because I was around my family. I made sure everyone tested to make sure they didn’t get it. It kind of ruined the trip from the standpoint of I had to cut it early to get home safely so I wasn’t around the people I was staying with. Because they have elderly people in the house. It was all around a very bad situation. So I don’t know if I’m going to be traveling any time soon. That really freaked me out. But where did I leave off? I feel like this whole episode is just me yapping and trapping.

Claire: Well, we were going to talk about your midlife crisis.

Joy: Okay. I’m going to gloss over it because here is what I want people to weigh in on. I kind of tongue and cheek say midlife crisis, but I would say in the past six months – four months, I don’t know. Four to six months. I’ve been feeling kind of chronic doom and gloom. At first, I was like, maybe this is still seasonal affective disorder. This is just the state of the world. Maybe it’s a lot of things. And it very well could be. I see a lot of people in practice in therapy where the daily drains of the pandemic and the state of the world, they kind of chip away like a death by a thousand paper cuts kind of thing is finally starting to kick in. At least for me, that’s what it feels like. I’m starting to get into that mode of, are things ever going to get better? You start kind of catastrophizing the world. I know everyone can kind of relate to this on some level. But it’s affecting my mood so much that I just can’t get into a happy place. I’m like, am I just experiencing a midlife crisis of existential “what am I doing with my life?” Or is it the weight of the world, just so freaking heavy right now, that it feels like nothing is getting better? So I kind of joke midlife crisis, but maybe there’s more to it. If anyone out there is experiencing that ongoing doom and gloom from what we’ve all collectively experienced the past few years especially, it’s just been a lot. So I didn’t want to put on this happy face that things have been going well, because they haven’t felt good. I know you mentioned that on the last episode of how you can’t even think about the current events because it’s so much. You just can only focus on dealing with what is in front of you with your family. I think what I came to realize is I was pushing so hard to get to a point of feeling okay, and I’m like, I don’t feel okay either, and I don’t really have the energy. All I can do right now is focus on raising these dogs. That’s the only thing I can focus on that gives me a little bit of joy and hope. That’s a little bit scary because that’s a whole thing that I talked about last time. Don’t get to the point where you’re almost giving up in a way. But I don’t know how to course correct. So that’s where I’m at. That’s all.

Claire: I mean, I think midlife crisis is a little bit of it. But maybe if it’s not going to get better now, when is it going to get better.

Joy: Well, let me add to this too, now that I think about it. A lot of mental health professionals are getting super burnt out. Luckily, I work for a company that is so good about taking care of mental health workers. They do a good job. But I don’t know any amount of caretaking you can do to not make it really emotionally draining on you. So I’m starting to see the effects of that, and that’s concerning to me. I hope if my current employer is listening to this, it’s absolutely nothing to do with them at all because they are amazing. But there is a part of me sometimes that wants to be like, can I just go work at Whole Foods and bag groceries? And these moments are fleeting, I get it. But sometimes you want to not have to take on so much – and I’m sure nurses are feeling this way. I’m sure teachers are feeling this way. I’m sure doctors – I mean. [sigh] So it’s a lot.

Claire: I know. As you were describing that feeling of being at a point where there is just so much going on or it feels like it’s relentless or endless, and is it every going to get better, what I was thinking of – and we don’t, again, ascribe to comparative suffering on this podcast. But I think that what you’re describing is something I have heard people, regardless of their career, regardless of their situation really describe it at varying points in the last two years. For some people, it was right away. For some people, I think especially people who had young kids at home or who were not able to keep working felt it immediately. And then maybe it was when the vaccine came out and you had to go head-to-head with people you were close to about their beliefs about the vaccine, and that’s when you started feeling like “I can’t do this anymore.” Or maybe it was when your office opened back up and you had to be back in person. You had to really question the priorities that you had to that company. Maybe that was when you thought, “I can’t do this anymore.” There has been a different breaking point for everyone. I don’t think I know a single person… I think you had a similar thing last year when you were recovering from your job situation. Part of me wonders if the fact that you had that happen sort of covered up a lot of the stuff from the pandemic because you were so focused on getting over that.

Joy: Yeah, and I was like in survival mode. I have one sole focus, which is what am I going to do next with my life. And that can be very true, for sure.

Claire: I think what you’re describing is a really shared experience. I was about to say, midlife crisis might be part of it. Maybe that adds into the factoring of just pondering your mortality, but I think that this is a really universal limit that a lot of people have reached at varying point. And maybe your breaking point was going to the store and for the fifth time they didn’t have the brand of cream cheese that you really wanted. It doesn’t have to be something monumental, but like you were saying, death by a thousand paper cuts. Whether you did have a huge moment of trying to work from home with three school-aged kids and tried to homeschool them or whatever, or whether you got to this point of I just can’t trudge through the mud anymore, I think that what you’re experiencing is so common right now. Not to minimize it at all. Instead to say –

Joy: No. I think that’s where I’m just kind of voicing it. I’m the type of person that tends to be like, “I’m going to handle it. I’m going to be the helper. I’m going to be the one that’s got the crap together.” It’s just exhausting. Will it get better? I think so. But I think I don’t do a good job of acknowledging when I’m in a bad place. Because it kind of scares me that I’m not going to get out of it.

Claire: For sure. I think that also is common – maybe not common, but it’s not like you are broken for feeling that way. There’s nothing about what you’re saying that’s like, “Wow Joy, I really don’t understand where you’re coming from.”

Joy: That’s so weird. I’m over here watching Wizard of Oz and eating popcorn.

Claire: I’m just sitting on the couch eating bonbons all day.

Joy: Which by the way, I know that I tend to do this too when I’m in this sad place – you know my favorite @cupcakesandcashmere account?

Claire: Yes.

Joy: Her Instagram is constant like living in Los Angeles. Every day she’ll go to a bakery.

Claire: She lives your dream life.

Joy: She lives my dream life.

Claire: She goes to Nordstrom like five times a week.

Joy: Shops. Wears cute clothes. Has beautiful, cute family, beautiful home. And I tend to do that cycle of idolizing where I am just like, oh man, my life just totally sucks. I don’t have this. That’s when I know I am in the danger zone. I’m like, stop idolizing someone else’s life.

Claire: She posted the other day. “I just want to be open that I’m going through something really hard right now, and I’m having a hard time.”

Joy: Yeah. She’s the first to admit. “I have panic attacks.” “I have major anxiety.” And I still will do that.

Claire: And you would hate that life. You would hate it.

Joy: Truly. But it’s a way for me to justify that I feel crappy about my life.

Claire: Because you’re not living in a mansion in LA.

Joy: You’re picking at a scab, like I just want to self-inflict this wound, this pain.

Claire: Fair.

Joy: Guys, I’m fine.

Claire: This is not a cry for help.

Joy: No, no, no. I got to air it. We’ve got to let it out. And then we’ve got to deal with it. And we will. [sigh] This was a lot of my heaviness on this episode.

Claire: I cried in last week’s episode, so I think you’re in the clear.

Joy: This is just how it’s going to be.

Claire: You know, the best thing about it is this is Joy and Claire.

Joy: It really is. And life is just the way it is. But we are here for you. We’d love to hear your stories about emotional breakdowns. How are you doing?

Claire: In airports, out of airports. I read something the other day that was talking about summer break and how we’re all so conditioned to look forward to summer and see it as this big release. It’s supposed to be really relaxing and recharging. That’s actually not the reality when you’re an adult. It’s easy to set yourself up for failure when you are imagining the way summer is going to be. And you get halfway through summer, and you’re like, wait a minute. My life is actually kind of the same no matter what I do. Except now in the summer it’s harder to put my kids to bed because it doesn’t get dark until 8:30/9 and I have to pay for my kid to go to camp.

Joy: Well that’s the other thing. I’m glad you brought that up. When I started to feel that lingering sadness continue through the spring and then summer, I’m like, wait a minute. This is supposed to be gone after the winter. Having that expectation of summer to be this magical, fun, happy time. I was like, oh no.

Claire: The only objective thing that’s different is slightly more Vitamin D availability.

Joy: Slightly more. Which I actually was so desperate the other day. I went to Target and bought – I’m sure Laura Ligos would be like, “Joy, it’s not going to work.”

Claire: You bought what?

Joy: I bought Vitamin D dummies that were like happy something. The whole title was like be happy something. I’m sure I could eat this entire thing and it’s not going to fix anything. But the placebo effect. I needed something. And every once in a while, I will do a placebo effect of something.

Claire: Because serotonin is also real. There’s something to that. There’s something to believing that whatever you’re getting going to help and you’re taking actions to fix yourself.

Joy: And they’re delicious and I love gummy vitamins.

Claire: I love a gummy vitamin.

Joy: So my friend is an ER doctor, and she is really involved in Canine Companions as well. We were texting back and forth because she had Covid recently too. She said something about an IV drip for vitamins. I go, “Do those Vitamin D bars actually help?” She’s like, “I don’t see why you can’t absorb vitamins through your mouth.” Yeah, that’s true. Basically you pee the whole thing out. And anyway, I just thought it was funny. I don’t get why you can’t absorb vitamins through your mouth.

Claire: Right. Unless you are in a medical situation where you have to have things delivered in a certain format. Like go drink a Nuun tablet.

Joy: To be fair, I’ve done an IV drop before of those vitamins, just because I wanted a placebo effect. I will do stupid crap like that just to be like, this feels like a fun toy to play with. Anyway, let’s end. Let’s just take a pause on all this so people can chime in. I need some people right now. I need people to come in and say, “This is also something I’m going through.” I need some community support. Selfishly. Maybe it is a cry for help. [laughing]

Claire: We’re just going to leave all this drama – not drama, you know what I mean. We’re going to leave all of this strife here in the episode, close the Burn Book.

Joy: Close it. I love it. This is why that exists. Close it. Put it in the Burn Book so that we can move on. I feel better already.

Claire: Great. Alright guys, well thank you so much for hanging in there with us this week. You can find us on Instagram @joyandclaire_. You can go to our beautiful website joyandclaire.com. You can email us thisisjoyandclaire@gmail.com. We know they are all different. We can’t do anything about it.

Joy: We can’t.

Claire: Choices were made long ago. Don’t forget to support the sponsors who support our podcast. Go to helloned.com, use discount code JOY for 15% off your order. Check out the Mellow if you’re not ready to try out CBD or if you’re just not into it. We love it. And it’s also tasty. It’s like Meyer lemon. It’s like a little cup of calm. And we will talk to you guys next Thursday, just like we have every Thursday for the last nine years.

Joy: And ever and ever again. We are still hanging on, even after today’s episode.

Claire: We appreciate you.

Joy: We invite you onto our private jet.

Claire: There will be a Patreon link sent out later. Alright guys. Bye.

Joy: Bye.

131: Not Our Normal

June 16, 2022 by Joy Parrish Leave a Comment

Lessons from going viral, Cadet’s graduation date, what to do if you’re overwhelmed with the state of the world, collective grief, lime washing, and diet culture reminders.

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www.joyandclaire.com

Girls Gone Wod

email: thisisjoyandclaire@gmail.com

Instagram: joyandclaire_

This is Joy & Claire Episode 131: Not Our Normal

Episode Date: June 16, 2022

Transcription Completed: August 6, 2022

Audio Length: 53:32 minutes

Joy: Hey guys, this is Joy.

Claire: And this is Claire.

Joy: How do you like our new theme song, by the way? It’s really, really uppity. So we have to lift up our intros a little more.

Claire: Which is hard sometimes. Like right now when it’s 8am on a Sunday morning, and my voice has not quite joined us yet. We’re recording this really early, like almost two weeks early. We always release on Thursdays. Normally we record that same week on Monday or even Tuesday. So our episodes are typically not recorded all that far in advance. But when life gets busy, we do batch them a little bit more. When you’re listening to this, these time frame statements will be out of date. But I am still a little bit in Covid recovery. I had Covid. I ended up testing positive for Covid for like 12 days. It was really pretty tough. I did not enjoy it. Zero out of ten. I have a little bit of asthma. For those of you who don’t know a fun fact about me is that I was born pretty prematurely. I was born at like 30 weeks or something and lived the first month of my life in an incubator.

Joy: Do did I. I think that’s pretty common for twins.

Claire: It’s pretty common for twins. Actually my mom had gone into labor at like 23 or 24 weeks. I’m going to tell this horror story. I think I’ve told it before. They sewed her cervix shut. And then finally at 30 weeks, my water broke. So I’m a twin. I have a fraternal twin brother. Two sacks, right. So my water broke. Well, this train is rolling, so they removed the stitches, but they missed one.

Joy: Nope. Nope, nope, nope. You should have put a warning on that one. You should have put a warning on this one.

Claire: So she was in labor with a stitch in her cervix, and she was like, “Something is wrong.” And they were like, “It’s supposed to hurt.” Because medical professionals gaslight women. She was like, “You will look again.”

Joy: Go Carol.

Claire: There was one in there. Anyway. So I was a preemie.

Joy: I think we have to sing from now on anything that’s horrific. Just sing it.

Claire: Just sing it. The reason I bring this up is that when you are a fetus, one of the last things to develop are your lungs. So preemies tend to go on to have sensitive respiratory systems for the rest of their lives, and that is very much me. I’m the type of person that any time I get sick, I will have a cough for weeks. Even if it’s not really like a respiratory illness. With Covid being very much a respiratory illness, I anticipate – I almost said participate. I anticipate.

Joy: You are participating.

Claire: I am participating against my will. I anticipate having a cough all summer, so fun for me. Anyway.

Joy: All that to say is the first time that we put the new intro song, it was on the episode that you had Covid. I texted Claire and I was like, “This is a real right turn.” It goes from a real uppity song, and then Claire is like, “Hi…”

Claire: My voice is just so far down.

Joy: Anyway, whatever, we like it. We got a rebrand. We’re all happy. Things are rocking.

Claire: It’s been a couple years.

Joy: I changed my mind about going viral is the new update.

Claire: Oh, you like it now?

Joy: No. I don’t like it. I don’t hate it.

Claire: Oh, okay. You’ve half changed your mind.

Joy: I’ve half changed my mind. I don’t hate it because what it did for me was completely made me ignore the comments section. I don’t read it anymore.

Claire: Not a one.

Joy: I don’t pay attention to it anymore. If you’re commenting, great. I love you. It forced me to completely ignore the comments section. Because there were so many comments rolling in that we couldn’t keep up. At first, we were browsing, reading, and then we’d see all the awful people coming in that were just saying the stupidest crap. So I changed my mind a couple weeks later. Actually, that was the silver lining of going viral is that you just don’t pay attention.

Claire: You get desensitized. I go onto our newer posts and specifically look at the comments. I feel like the people who actually know us are still commenting and I don’t want them to feel left out. And not even left out. That’s why we’re on social media is it’s a place where we can engage with you guys in real time, unlike anywhere else. If we did not really deeply value that, we would have left social media years ago. But I agree with you. So also, just your friendly reminder that if you ever really have a question for us that you are really hoping for an answer to, please send us an email. Don’t send it in a DM. DM’s get lost super quickly because we have a lot of notifications. People just send random reaction not our Instagram stories all the time. Those quick little comments, we like to read. And we will often times see your DM with a longer question and think, oh I need to get back to that later, and then it’s gone by the time we get back to it. Send us an email if you ever have a question that you are hoping for an actual answer to. Our email address is thisisjoyandclaire@gmail.com. Great. This feels like a lot of housekeeping.

Joy: Sometimes we have to do it.

Claire: It’s true.

Joy: Well, when this episode airs – it’s kind of weird to… that’s another reason we don’t like recording so far in advance, just because I like to talk about the week ahead. But when this episode airs, I will be in Arizona. I’m going to visit some family for the week. So I’ll be there all week. And hopefully by then, Cadet will have graduated. I wish I could give you an update now, but we’re recording this so far in advance, it’s hard to tell. It’s hard to tell. So just keep an eye on social media. Or you already have seen it actually. It’s in the past.

Claire: There’s already a reel about it.

Joy: This is old news already.

Claire: But the update this week, as of Sunday, June 5, is that Cadet pre-matched. Which last week we talked about what that meant. So she is on her way, potentially, assuming that everything goes well during team training. And it’s very exciting.

Joy: Yeah, it’s so cool. So they called us a couple of days ago. Again, this is old news by now. But it’s still great news. I’ll celebrate it forever. But they called us and said she has a pre-match, and that just basically means when you go to team training, you are pre-matched with a person. They watch you for a week to make the trainers watch very closely to make sure it’s the right match. They want to do a really good job of making sure that everything is set up for success. And if all goes well for the remainder of that week, then you graduate. So we’ll be flying out. It’s kind of funny because a cousin is getting married on June 11. We had always planned to go out for that wedding, and then I am going to stay for the week to see family and just hang out. I was so worried that Cadet’s graduation was going to be the same day as my cousin’s wedding. Honestly for a hot minute, and my cousin Lauren, if you’re listening, don’t worry, I would never miss Garrett’s wedding. She listens to this podcast. She’s like, “Joy!” For a minute, I was like, oh man, that would be a tossup.

Claire: Right.

Joy: Do I miss Garrett’s wedding? Or do I go to Cadet’s graduation? Thankfully I don’t have to make a choice. We are just going to be jet setting and flying to Arizona right after Cadet’s graduation. But I’m so excited to see her. But this podcast will be in the past, and I have hopefully already given her a big hug and sent her off to her new journey.

Claire: Cute, cute. Okay, the other thing we wanted to open this episode with is in the past couple of months, with just the world getting more and more horrible, we get a lot of questions from you guys around what do you do to manage the stress, the fear, the hopelessness. There’s just a lot that we have all been dealing with for a long time now. At varying degrees, but at the same time, I don’t know a single person who is like, “I’m actually pretty fine.” One of the things that, Joy, you always say is don’t let it get to the point where you just don’t care anymore. You want to avoid getting there. But I think the reality is that a lot of us have actually been at that point for a while. I want to hear from your therapy hat perspective – and friendly reminder, Joy is a licensed clinical therapist with a decade plus of experience.

Joy: Two decades almost. Which is actually really scary every time I say it. But it is what it is, guys. Age happens.

Claire: Age happens. It is a privilege to grow old. What do we do if we are past the point of being so overwhelmed by the deluge that we don’t care anymore? How do you come back from that?

Joy: Well, my first question – I want to say this as a little bit of context. Where are you at? I’m curious to hear, and I’m sure a lot of listeners are curious to hear – I’m not saying people who are parents have a – I think you absolutely have a different experience. Maybe I’m projecting. I feel like you would have a more intense experience around the school shootings because obviously you have school-age children.

Claire: Yeah, no, it’s horrible.

Joy: Not to do the comparative suffering thing, but when these things happen, I think of all the parents who are dropping their kids off at school. Where are you at as a parent? Talk to all the parents out there about what that does for you and how you’re currently dealing with that stress.

Claire: It’s really, really hard. Miles will be going into first grade. Evie is 3.5 but will be entering kindergarten in two years. I just keep thinking, this problem is not going anywhere. You want to think that you are safe, and you want to tell your kids that they’re safe. I think about the shooting at the Boulder King Soopers last year. I knew people who lost people in that shooting. The illusion of convincing yourself that it can’t happen in your community is gone for me already.

Joy: Gone completely, yeah.

Claire: I think that is actually such a helpful illusion. Even if you know in the back of your head that there is nothing different about your community. If you can convince yourself that it can’t happen, I honestly think that that is kind of helpful. Because at the end of the day, there is really so little that you individually can do. So just letting yourself believe that you’re safe… I wish that I could still do that. I don’t want to say, live your life willfully ignorant. But I think we all understand at some level. We all definitely understand that we’re not safe. But the less you have to consciously think about that, I think the better. This is my very non-professional opinion of how to process this. But yeah. I would say I really can’t think about it because there is nothing I can do.

Joy: Well, it’s a protective factor. Like when you’re at that level, you’re overwhelmed. I think that’s what happens when people – so kind of parlaying that into what your question was. I talk about this a lot during therapy. You get to a point where if you imagine the bucket filling to the top, you can’t take anymore. You are tapped out. So your body just shuts down. Or your mind shuts down. And you’re like, I can’t take anymore because it’s like your mind and your body are doing its job in a way to where you’re like, I can’t take any more so I’m just going to completely ignore what’s going on. On some level, you may have to do that for a while to take care of your family or to take care of whatever you need to take care of. So I think what I’m saying is, when you get so overwhelmed to a point where you don’t care or you just get complacent, I think that’s when you want to recognize that difference. I think there’s little bit of nuance in that in the sense of, yes, it’s a protective factor of you can’t keep facing the horrible news. But at the same time, where do you feel you can contribute? So turning that energy of overwhelm and not looking at the negativity per se but turning that into something where you feel like you can take some action. I’m not saying you have to go out and do something 24/7. But instead of looking at the news and absorbing the bad news or looking at the worry and absorbing the worry, where can you donate to places? Where can you make a contribution in your community? Those types of things that put more positive back into your system and build your back up, as opposed to make you feel tapped out. So that’s what I think is the important difference. You become so stressed and overwhelmed to the point where you’re like, I just can’t pay attention anymore. Well the sad reality is we have to pay attention in order to fix it. So it’s this weird catch 22. But at the same time, we also have to realize that we have responsibilities, and we have to take care of our families, and we have to take care of our jobs, and we have to do the things that we normally do. You add onto the normal responsibilities of your life, and that’s where people are like, “I don’t have the bandwidth for that.” It’s interesting too where people will also start to do this thing of, “Well I don’t have it as bad.” People will also start to feel guilty – that was amazing. River has entered the chat.

Claire: River just came into the room. I’m sitting on the floor. She just opened the door and started licking my face. Sorry, go on. I’m sure that was very chaotic on camera.

Joy: It was very chaotic. I was like, woah, there is a dog right here. But people start to do this thing to where you start to feel guilty for tapping out. So I don’t want to say that if you’re tapping out you are doing anything wrong. Your body is doing what it is supposed to do, which is protect you from completely shutting down. It’s almost like a trip wire where your body is just like, “We’re done.” You start to do this thing too where you’re like, “Well, I have so much to be thankful for.” A lot of people do this in therapy. They come to me and are like, “I feel bad for feeling bad because I have it better than most people.” I appreciate that. That means you are a caring, compassionate person.

Claire: But your nervous system doesn’t care about that.

Joy: Right. Your nervous system is like, we are in danger. There is danger in our environment. We are in fight, flight, or freeze. What the heck do we do? I think that’s something to notice as well. Thank you so much, human, for being a caring, sensitive person that you do recognize all of your blessings. But at the same time, you can also feel overwhelmed. And there’s probably a million different answers to this question, but what I personally do and what I tell people to do when we’re talking about this in therapy is to find some sense of control where you feel like you are contributing to a solution, whatever that looks like to you. There’s a lot of talk about the problem. I think what we need to be paying more attention to is the solution. And I’m not talking about reading the news of opinions or the comment sections or people posting. That actually drains you. That’s also what I’ve been telling people. Do not read news. Be informed, but don’t read opinion pieces. Don’t watch people arguing over what the solution is, what you feel might be a solution. What is the action step, a very tangible action step that feels like a part of a solution? And that’s going to be different for everybody. But that’s why it’s important to find what that answer is for yourself. Then you feel like you are doing something to move the needle a little bit. I think what we get wrapped up in is the problem feel so big and has been going on for so long that there’s that whole, “Well, if Moms Demand Action hasn’t been able to do anything,” – well, actually they have. If you read what they’ve accomplished so far, they’ve actually done a lot. Don’t get caught up in the whole, “I’m just one person” fallacy. We can’t do anything if I’m just one person. Trust that you have a lot of power. If we all take one small step every single day or every single week or every month even, whatever you have the energy for, we can move the needle. I think that’s what battles that overwhelm.

Claire: I think that’s been a big thing for me is feeling like it doesn’t matter what I do. All I can do – I deleted Instagram for a while. It feels so intense that even if I see a post about it that I’m not ready for, I just have to walk away. I can’t take in any amount of information at this point. Hopefully that will change. It’s not always this intense when there is a shooting. I don’t want to get too far into it because I know a lot of other people are in that boat too, and describing it might not be helpful. It’s hard even for me to talk about it. I think I quickly get to that point of almost the next level of no amount of action will change anything, so I’m not even going to look for ways to feel productive. And not only that but feeling like the way for me to get out of this is to channel into action almost just feels like something else, like another box I have to check off, like something else I have to do.

Joy: I hear what you’re saying. It’s not that you have to do it. It’s that most of the time when we are feeling overwhelmed and numb, it feels like we don’t have control or we’ve lost a sense of stability in our life. And we do. There’s all of these bad things that are happening, and we live in a society where people are making decisions about the very important laws around us and we don’t have that control. But I think using your voice in some way – even something as small as telling a friend something kind that day. It doesn’t even have to be a large cause because maybe that is feeling like too much right now. Even a small act of kindness to take you out of that spin can be really helpful. I’ve been trying to do more of telling people a compliment if I’m thinking it. Or writing someone a thank you note that was something very small. Or whatever it is – picking up a piece of trash when I’m walking outside. You feel like I’m doing something so small, but I feel like the thought and the energy towards doing something positive for this world right now is the only thing I can muster. Fine. That is okay. Not every single one of us needs to be Shannon Watts on the frontline of Moms Demand Action for gun safety. She is amazing. She’s been doing it for a very long time, and I think that’s another piece of we feel like we have to be doing it to that level. I’ll get caught up in this too. You’ll see on Instagram all the people that are doing very large acts of advocacy. Then you feel like you should be doing that level of advocacy. No. And maybe your solution isn’t advocacy. You see what I’m saying? It’s just getting to a point where you feel like it’s just not constantly taking, like where the energy of the world is not taking from you. You are at a point of filling yourself up in a way that’s contributing to society.

Claire: Yeah, I think that makes sense. If you’re somebody listening to this who is also to the point of feeling really helpless and overwhelmed by it and have had a hard time getting out of that space, the biggest thing I have learned over the last couple of weeks is that it really feels like grief.

Joy: It’s absolutely collective grief. And I think that started when the pandemic started.

Claire: Sure. And I think that – oh, here comes Evie Joan.

Evie: Momma, the sun is awake.

Claire: The sun is awake? Thank you for telling me. Okay, bye.

Joy: I mean, that’s a part of joy.

Claire: It’s a headline.

Joy: It just fills you up. That just touched my heart. The sun is awake. We all needed that. Case and point.

Claire: She just needs to come and tell everybody. I just want to also, at least for me, to say out loud, I can’t. I still can’t. I just can’t do anything. And deleting social media has been really helpful. I get teary just thinking about it. I’m still at a point where there are almost no option, it feels like, available to me other than to just step away. So I am trying to honor that as much as I can and not worry about finding things I have to do.

Joy: There’s a lot of levels to this. I think that if you’re at a point where you’re like, I can’t even take an action, then maybe it is just doing nothing for a while. Because this can also be so individual. Where my suggestions come from, you guys, is not that these are the right answers. It’s just a answer. It’s just a suggestion. Everyone is so different of how you deal with it. But I think the bottom line is that it’s normal to feel like you can’t handle any more because this should not be our normal. This really should not be our normal. This should not be happening in our world. We should not be losing children to gun violence. This is the sad part of reality is that it is happening. So how do you marry that in your mind of reality, especially if you have young children? So if you are at that point, like Claire just said too, of “I just can’t.” Then that is where you start. You shouldn’t feel guilty about that either. Maybe all you can do is focus on providing love and care for your family and getting a good night’s sleep and drinking enough water and putting your own family as your main focus. If that’s all you can do, then that’s all you can do. It’s a good point to bring up too, Claire, because I’m sure a lot of people also are at that point of, “I don’t even know where to start. I have zero energy to even think about it. I have to turn it off.” Sometimes people are like, “You can’t look away. This is a problem.” But we should never be forced into… it’s fine to take a break. That doesn’t mean that you don’t care. You care so much, and that is why you have to take a break – because you care so much. Because you’re a mother of two young beautiful children. Because you’re trying to think about their safety. It’s so interesting to watch this play out on social media too of people judging how social media influencers post or the stances they take. That all of the sudden gives value to how much you care about an issue or not, or how much you’re posting about it. It’s very interesting ho that plays out. But needless to say, it is okay, listeners out there, if you are taking a break, if you are stepping away. I think it’s fine to be informed then to the extent of saying, “I do want to help move this needle” because we do feel like we need to do something. But maybe the doing something in this phase of your life right now, after a freaking pandemic that we’re still in, is to take care of yourself and your family and that is where you start. Because like we kind of started this conversation at the beginning of what do you do if you feel like you’re already at that point where you feel like you are completely tapped out? Then you start there. And you just take care of yourself and your family.

Claire: Whew. Okay We are going to move into to some more just broad life updates, but let’s take a quick breather. A moment.

Joy: Let’s take a quick breather with our favorite sponsors, Ned. I couldn’t think of a better transition because they are just all about self-care and love and products that nourish you. I think y’all saw on our stories last week – maybe not. This is so outdated. But maybe you saw a story where I posted, I’m so amped about Cadet, but I need to calm down because I need to go to bed. That’s when I took Ned. It was the perfect solution for that evening because I was so amped up. We talk so much about the ways that we use Ned, but that was an example where I’m like, this is a perfect time to show when Ned really, really world.

Claire: The other thing I want to say too is sometimes we get emails from people that are asking, hey, this is the problem that I’m trying to help through CBD use. What would you suggest? Joy and I obviously can only speak to ourselves and our experiences. You guys all know that. Ned has an awesome service that you can go online and sign up for a consultation where they have herbalists and experts on their staff who will meet with you for free and talk through what it is that you’re trying to accomplish and recommend the best regiment of products for you. It’s basically a sales consultation. So to be completely honest, they’re trying to get you to buy their products. It’s not an unbiased moment. But if you are really curious about CBD and exactly the best way for you to be using it for something specific, highly recommend signing up for that. I have a ton of friends who have done that, and it’s really, really helpful. The suggestions that they make are really, really effective. Definitely check that out because it’s a cool service that they provide.

Joy: Yeah. And just a reminder that you are supporting the podcast when you support our sponsor, Ned. They have full transparency on their website. They share their third-party lab reports, who farms their products, their extraction process. All on their website. And remember they have a full money back guarantee if you’re not satisfied. Become the best version of yourself. Get 15% off Ned products with code JOY. Go to helloned.com/JOY or enter code JOY at checkout. That’s helloned.com/JOY to get 15% off. Thank you, Ned, for sponsoring the show and giving our listeners a natural remedy for some of life’s most common health issues.

Claire: Okay. Well in other life updates, I’m still living in boxes. A fun project that we’ve been working on that I wanted to share is we’re doing lime wash paint on our living room. Which is something that I asked a question about on my Instagram, and I think people are kind of confused about what it is. You can paint brick with lime wash. That’s the application that most people know. But you also can do your walls. It ends up with this really awesome, very, very matte, very lightly textured finish that almost looks like plaster. But it’s not as gloppy as plaster. The primer was bizarre because you basically are creating a super porous surface on your wall. Let me back up. It’s basically a type of paint that’s made out of actual lime from limestone.

Joy: I’m googling images right now because I’m not familiar with it. Where did you learn about lime wash?

Claire: Instagram.

Joy: Of course you did.

Claire: I spend a lot of time on the ‘Gram.

Joy: I really want to paint my fireplace BTW.

Claire: Oh, we’re going to paint our fireplace. I’ll let you know how it goes.

Joy: Okay. With lime wash?

Claire: Probably not with lime wash. We’re probably just going to use paint. The thing that people like about the lime wash for brick is that it still leaves the natural brick look, but it just makes it look a little powdery for lack of a better word.

Joy: Yeah, because paint makes it look a little too painted.

Claire: So the lime wash is not a stain. It is actually a type of paint. But because it’s so porous on brick, it gets absorbed into the brick. It makes it just look like an old whitewashed look.

Joy: Okay, okay.

Claire: The point of the story – I won’t get into exactly the details of every single thing, in case you’re like, “I don’t want to listen to you talk about lime wash paint for 20 minutes.”

Joy: We’re watching paint dry on our podcast.

Claire: Exactly. But it’s really been fun and interesting. I’m really excited for how it’s going to make the room – we’re doing it in the front room of our house, which is this big, open room that connects to the dining room. It just creates this really nice little texture and makes the room feel really cozy. And then we’re deciding on the cabinet paint colors we want to use. Our house that we moved into was built in 1970. It’s a floor plan that – I think I already talked about this. It’s literally the exact same floor plan that Brandon grew up in. It’s also extremely similar to the house that I grew up in. The main floor is almost exactly the same, and the upstairs is just a different configuration. So this was a very popular plan, the house plan, in the 70’s. Where you walk in the front door and you’re staring at a coat closet. To the right is a sitting room that backs up to a dining room that flows into the kitchen. Then as you walk through the kitchen, you’re looking at the living room and you can turn up the hallway to go back to the front door. And then if you’re standing at the front door and you look to the left, you go up the stairs into the upstairs.

Joy: Okay.

Claire: Really common in the 70’s, and the last time it was updated was in like 1990. So we are not doing a renovation per se because that’s expensive.

Joy: Just a little pricey. Just bought a house.

Claire: And I currently still own two houses because, fun fact, the housing market has slammed on the breaks the last month and our house has not sold yet. Ha ha ha ha ha.

Joy: But you just put it up.

Claire: I mean, yes, but it should have sold. We don’t have any offers yet. It’s been up for a couple days. That has not been the norm for the past few years.

Joy: Sure.

Claire: Hopefully by the time you listen to this… I don’t have any wood around me that’s real. I have some particle board wood.

Joy: Touch wood, yeah.

Claire: Hopefully our house will be under contract. It’s a cute, cute house. But for a variety of reasons, including the fact that we don’t know for sure how long it’s going to take our other house to sell, we are not doing any big renovations. We’re painting everything, and that’s just a really fun process to go through. We’ve been using these paint stickers. This is not an ad. This company called Samplize, and they will send you this 8.5 by 11 – those aren’t the real dimensions, but it’s about that big – piece of vinyl sticker that is the paint color that you want. So you can put the sticker on your wall, and you can move it around your house to see how it looks in different lights.

Joy: That’s brilliant.

Claire: Instead of having to paint a sample and paint back over it and wait for it to dry. They are like $5 or $6 a piece. I have been going ham on these samples. Maybe if I was going less ham on the paint samples, I would have enough money to renovate our kitchen. But highly recommend if you are painting. These are so fun. So we’re kind of in that mode right now of choosing paint colors. We’re still really not unpacked. Because part of it too is we don’t want to unpack everything, only to then have to paint and move everything again. We’re still sort of in this annoying in between of having a lot of stuff in boxes, but that’s just going to be my whole summer I think with the way that the timing played out and that we couldn’t get it done – we missed our window to get it done the week before we moved. So now instead, we have to pay the price. And by get it done, I mean painting and those sorts of thing. So that’s pretty much my 24/7 project right now is trying to get this house into a livable condition so it doesn’t feel like we just moved in. Even though we did just move in. I just hate that feeling. It’s very disorganizing. I don’t know if you guys saw my reel about this, but my brain has really not recovered from Covid.

Joy: Oh man.

Claire: And I have been forgetting things. It is very unlike me to forget things. I am not the type of person who forgets appointments or anything like that. Two days ago, I forgot to take River to doggy day care. Just forgot. It wasn’t like I’m so late or I forgot to reschedule. Halfway through the day, I was just like, oh my God, I was supposed to take River to doggy day care today. Just forgot. And then Joy and I did a little content shoot where we have this really cute little photo studio that’s in Longmont called Sugar Hill Studios that we rent out just for an hour. We just take our iPhones. If you are in the Denver area and you are someone who is supposed to create content for any reason and you hate it, I would recommend trying this place out. This place is so cute. It’s really affordable on an hourly basis. I love it. And it’s run by the cutest photographer. Her name is Sarah Hill. And also, not an ad, but if you’re ever looking for family photos in the Denver area, highly recommend her.

Joy: I can’t stop looking at lime wash, by the way. [laughing]

Claire: Oh my gosh, right. It’s so soothing.

Joy: Now I want to paint my fireplace, and I’m like, what do I paint it? I’m going to stop. But it’s very soothing to look at.

Claire: It is really soothing to look at. It’s a nice texture. But I forgot about the photo shoot until I got the reminder on my phone 30 minutes before, and I was standing in line to order coffee by the grocery store. It’s a whole thing.

Joy: Yeah. Claire texted me. You’re like, “I’m going to be a few minutes late.” I was like, “Okay.” I’m pulling up, and you’re like, “I forgot.”

Claire: Thank God this place is five minutes from my house. I probably just wouldn’t have made it.

Joy: Right.

Claire: It would have been Joy only. So that’s been super fun. What are you guys doing for the summer coming up?

Joy: A lot of puppy watching. I’m going to Arizona. I’ll be in Arizona when this airs. We don’t really have trips planned yet because we have a lot of dog sitting situations coming up where we are puppy sitting for a lot of the CCI dogs. But as far as a vacation, we really want to go back to Hawaii. But I don’t know, it’s at that point still where you just don’t know what’s going on with Covid. I don’t want to plan too many things. It’s hard to tell. As of right now, we’re mostly trying to visit family because we haven’t been able to do that in the past few years. So we’ll probably go see Scott’s parents, do more trips to my parents’ house, and obviously I’ll be hanging out a lot in Arizona and having a good time seeing all those people.

Claire: So as we march directly into summer, we wanted to talk a little bit about diet, exercise stuff that really flares up this time of year. Just remind you all that your winter body and your summer body are the same. Your year-round body does not need to change in any way, shape, or form for the summer, just because it’s summer. If this is a season where you find it’s easier to fit in more activity, that you are already naturally drawn toward eating more fresh foods, let that just be what it is. Let that just be a seasonal rhythm of your body. I think it’s natural in the summer. It’s lighter way longer. Fresh foods are more readily available. They are more delicious because they are more fresh. You don’t have to assign any value or weirdness to that. It can just be what it is, and you can just not have to overthink it. If you’re finding yourself naturally wanting to move more, do it and you don’t have to start a whole program. You don’t have to sign up for a marathon. You don’t have to buy a Groupon, Joy, for a marathon.

Joy: I know. There was a half marathon this weekend that Scott was like, “Maybe we should just run this half marathon. We just ran ten miles.” I was like, maybe we should. We didn’t.

Claire: No. No.

Joy: But there’s beer at the end, and it’s put on by this beer company.

Claire: You don’t even drink beer.

Joy: We don’t even drink beer right now. Non-alcoholic beer is really my jam these days.

Claire: And guess what? It’s available to buy at the store without running a race.

Joy: Yeah, without running. So funny.

Claire: Zero running required. Probably cheaper than the race entry. People are like, “It’s free beer.” I’m like, it’s definitely not free beer. You just spent $100 to run the race. Anyway, I just wanted to say that because I know that this is the time of year – and it’s been that way now for a couple months already. But now that it really is summer break for kids. I think we’ve come a really long way in the last several years of not getting swept up in that stuff. But we used to not only get swept up in it but lead the sweep. Like, “Okay guys, time for a challenge.” It doesn’t have to be that way. You don’t have to suddenly decide you want your body to be different. It can be the same. It can be exactly the way it’s always been. A lot of people gained weight in Covid, and that’s great.

Joy: We were just soothing ourselves through a really hard time.

Claire: Your body is creating protective instincts. And again, it doesn’t mean anything about you. It could mean something about your health. If you’re worried about it, go ask your doctor about it. That’s valid. We’re not saying to just sweep unexplained, rapid weight gain under the rug. That could be a red flag.

Joy: Right. There’s so many different ways it could go. I think what we’re trying to say is a blanket whole statement of, watch out, diet culture is going to rear its ugly head if it hasn’t already. I am loving seeing a lot of ads from retailers with every shape and size in bathing suits. We’ve come a long way. It used to be I’d be flipping through J.Crew magazine, eating my cereal before I went to college class – and yes, this is an actual catalog.

Claire: It’s a real piece of paper.

Joy: And actual paper. And I’d be like, aw man, I don’t look like those girls with their very small stomachs. But it’s so funny how now we have an inclusion, an inclusivity… what’s the right word? Inclusive body types.

Claire: Yeah. A variety of representative body types. Representation.

Joy: Representation. And I love that. I think that’s been really good to see. But be careful of like, you need to take this supplement, you need to go on this diet. Claire and I are not immune from this. I think we each deal with it in different ways of course. But I have noticed, speaking of bodies and the news and media and how that affects us. Recently there’s been so much press around the bodies of the Kardashians. I don’t know if you’ve seen any of the articles, but any time I scroll on my little Apple News feed, it is weather Khloe’s body –

Claire: I think you must be in the Kardashian algorithm or whatever.

Joy: Yeah. Our phones listen to us. I’m screwing myself right now. My phone is listening. Khloe’s body is too this or too that. Or Kim’s body and her diet that she did to fit into that dress is too this and too that. And honestly, it just is distracting us and making us think what is wrong with our bodies or how we look like that. Let me just remind you, that’s not reality. I hate to project this, but I know that I’ve seen ads for them doing that cooling scoped whatever it is. Have you heard of this? There’s a machine that you can put on your body that literally will –

Claire: Freezes your fat cells or something.

Joy: That or it works out a part of your body. Kind of like one of those things that used to shake your waist. You know, like those belts from the 50’s and 60’s? It’s kind of like that where it works out a body part the equivalent to an hour workout in five minutes, so it really tones your muscles. My guess is that they’re doing that, guys. And it’s okay, it’s fine. But –

Claire: Here’s a reminder for everyone. If it seems too good to be true, it is.

Joy: It is. It is.

Claire: When it comes to diet and fitness, if it seems to be too good to be true, it is.

Joy: It’s an MLM. Run away.

Claire: This is how cults start. I have been seeing a lot more posts. I think Laura Ligos is really good about this. JK is really good about this. People who are like, hey, if you are somebody that has health and fitness goals. Again, you don’t have to have health and fitness goals. Blanket statement. I used to think that an absence of health and fitness goals meant that I was letting myself go or I didn’t care about myself or it wasn’t self-care. A lot of times, self-care means letting yourself not have those goals for a season of life because you’ve been drilling away at them for decades and you need a freaking break. But if you are someone who has health and fitness goals, it is the little consistent habits, unsexy habits – going for walks, taking the stairs, making sure you’re drinking enough water, making sure you’re getting enough freaking sleep. The things that are going to take a really long time to move the needle are still the things that are most effective. So if it sounds too good to be true, it is. If there is a challenge that promises anything in 30 days or 6 weeks or even 90 days or 75 days or whatever it is, it’s probably too good to be true. You can’t change your life and your body in a couple of months. It takes years to get to that point in a sustainable way. We all know this. We all know this. And yet we let logic fly out the window when we get an email saying, “90-day body shred,” and you’re like, oh 90 days.

Joy: They must have cracked the code.

Claire: No, they have not. What I was just talking about around feeling like you have to have a health or fitness goal. We got a great email recently, and I’m going to paraphrase it because I’m not going to pull it up right this second, but we got a great email from somebody who recently had a baby and used to be really, really active and worked out a ton, who basically said through some of the comments we’ve made on the podcast and through some of her own realizations has been embracing the fact that what you are doing or not doing in a certain season of your life is not who you are. We are so programmed to make our activities about who we are. For an example that I brought up a few weeks ago, I haven’t been baking that much lately. That doesn’t mean I don’t still love baking. That doesn’t mean that it’s not still something that is important to me from a standpoint of creativity, of sharing it with my family, of sharing it with my community. There’s so many things I still love about it. I just haven’t had much time to do it lately. Same thing for CrossFit. I think I’ll always love CrossFit. I think I’ll always love being in the gym in that environment of people, in that group, lifting weights, the high-intensity workouts, the loud music. I love the environment. There’s not a CrossFit gym that I like that’s in a convenient enough place for me that I can do that right now. It’s not that I’ve moved away from CrossFit. No, it just doesn’t fit in my life right now. Who knows if that might change. Maybe I’ll start going to a gym in Denver one day. Whatever the case may be. I think the opposite is true. We talked about this with JT a little bit on our more recent episode with him around you can still do things and it doesn’t – just because I’ve been waking up every morning to go work out doesn’t mean that I’m suddenly a morning person. Or just because I want to try going on a couple more trail runs doesn’t mean, oh, now I’m a runner. We need to move away from making the blanket statements around ourselves based on just these activities that we’re doing. I think that feeds so much into diet culture around making you feel like if this is not one of your top priorities your whole life, then that means you are not a healthy person. And that is just BS. We all know it is, right?

Joy: I feel like this has always been around, but when did we value health and fitness as this elitist, “we’re better than other people” type of mentality that used to be a thing. It used to be like that. I think that I was guilty of that for a while early in my fitness career. And when I did all the trainings to become a fitness instructor in college. I was in a different mindset. Or the way that I would talk to my friends and coworkers about how I was eating. And everyone always wanted to know what I was eating, and I would always tell them what I was eating. It was always like at thing, I remember, of what does Joy eat or not eat. Or how much I worked out and how that was this badge of honor. And now you look at it and you’re like, that was just a really unhappy part of me that people were idolizing or at least just commenting on. I think it’s more along the lines of making sure, because it’s such a sensitive thing and I don’t think it’s ever going to go away, to be aware of where our Achilles heels are in this fitness space, in the fitness/wellness/diet space, to follow people like Laura Ligos, to follow people like JK who are just doing it for the purpose of, if this feels good for you, do it. If this feels right for you, do it. It’s okay to want to eat well because if we just want to look at it objectively, I feel physically better when I eat better.

Claire: Your body thrives on nutrients and sufficient calories.

Joy: It just does. It just does. And I’m also not the person who is like, “I wish I could thrive off of cookies.” That doesn’t sound good to me either. I know that people will be annoyed by that. But I am at a point in my life where I am not restricting, so I don’t have to torture myself to eat healthy either. I just objectively feel better eating “healthier foods.” Foods that make me feel good, however you want to label it. I’ll even see influencers. I’ve unfollowed so many people over the years who every single post is about optimizing every nutrient that goes into your body, or you have to eat this every day for this mineral. It’s like, I just feel like having a liquid IV because it tastes good. Maybe it throws some extra water my way. But I don’t need to make sure I’m eating beef liver for this part of my whatever. It can go a little too far, I think.

Claire: Yeah.

Joy: That’s all I’m saying is we don’t have to be perfect with it. Find what works for you. Just be careful.

Claire: Also, we try to be really transparent around the stuff that we’re doing and the fact that it can be fun to try stuff out. It’s all about allowing yourself to try stuff and not make it about anything bigger. Not make it a lifestyle statement. Not make it a statement about your personality. Right now in my health and fitness journey, right now I’m not doing anything. I love June because I love berries. Why are blackberries so expensive, but I will take out a third mortgage for blackberries.

Joy: Which reminds me, I think the farmer’s market is going on this morning. I need to run down there and get some flowers.

Claire: Yeah, you should. We went yesterday to the Longmont one. The Longmont farmer’s market is so cute, you guys. They had this little Celtic band playing yesterday. I just loved it. Yeah, so cute. All these little toddlers dancing around. I loved it. And then they had these popsicles, which my kids loved. Which are almost $4 per popsicle. This is just highway robbery, but I buy them. I am basically paying $8 to be able to stay at the farmer’s market for longer now that my kids have popsicles. But I am excited about summer and about food because I love summer produce. I love corn. I love peaches. I love berries. I love asparagus. I love fresh lettuce. Just all the things. I love tomatoes. Oh, I love tomatoes so much. Those are the main crops that we really get that are grown in Colorado. We don’t get citrus or avocado, stuff like that. You can’t grow that in Colorado because the growing season is too short.

Joy: Take me to California.

Claire: I know.

Joy: They have the best farmer’s markets.

Claire: And when it comes to fitness, I haven’t been to the gym really since my surfing trip because of the move and the whole Covid situation. But I’m still signed up for HungryFitness. I still really like that programming. I like that it’s flexible. I like the ethos around her community. I don’t follow them all on Instagram because I do feel like their accounts are pretty health and fitness culture.

Joy: It’s a little before and aftery if I can be honest.

Claire: A little before and aftery, if I can be honest. I don’t love that.

Joy: Not so much a fan of that.

Claire: Not my vibe. But I do really like the programming, for what it’s worth. So you know, all that to say, I’m not changing anything this summer.

Joy: Yeah. A couple weeks ago, whenever it was, I posted a reel of making a smoothie because I do make this smoothie every morning. It’s so basic, and I’ve said it a billion times that I don’t follow recipes. I’m like, I can throw this together. I do it because I do objectively know that I don’t go for protein in my diet. Basic facts, you kind of, sort of, should focus on a more balanced – moving towards the middle, not being perfect.

Claire: Yeah, man cannot live on carbs alone.

Joy: No, sadly. And I’m such a carb person that I’ll just move towards the carbs. I know that about myself. I’ve just been ready more Dr. Stacy Sims of women as you age and you need more protein. I’m also on the Wild AI app. If you don’t have it, it’s amazing. It has a lot of really good tips for fueling for women. Science-backed. It’s run by doctors, so I feel like that is a really good app that’s how to fuel for female performance. So I was making protein smoothie. That feels really good to me. I just need to go for more protein in my diet. But not from a diet verb perspective. And then I’m just doing my Peloton. I’m working outside. I’m doing some Peloton workouts. I do some little bootcamp workouts, trying to get some more weightlifting in there because that just feels really good to me. And then walking my dogs. That’s something I have to do to train Joe, so that’s a daily activity. I just love being outside. But I will say, I’m screwing myself. I will say this lastly, which is really funny. I feel like social media is playing a cruel trick on us because I see a Tracy Anderson ad every single day on my social media feed. She is in a mesh fishnet looking bikini. I don’t understand why I am getting this ad. Why are you catering to me in a mesh bikini. I don’t want to look like that. If you want to wear that, great. No judgement. But why is this coming to me? And why is this the ad? Most of her customers, my guess, already look like her. It’s such a weird – now I’m going to get Tracy Anderson –

Claire: The fact that ten years later we’re still complaining about Tracy Anderson on this podcast, the longevity of those ads. It’s just amazing. It’s just amazing.

Joy: Yeah. Well on that note –

Claire: As you guys know, nothing sends me into a rage spiral faster than Tracy Anderson who thinks that women shouldn’t lift more than three pounds because they don’t want to get bulky and other things that are bad.

Joy: Have you seen that ad? I texted you a photo.

Claire: Oh yeah, you texted me. And I’ve seen it. The neon green fishnet underwear is just like I don’t need to see another human wearing that. I just don’t need to see that in my feed.

Joy: I’m scrolling through Facebook right now, and I’m just waiting for – oh, another Canine Companions litter was born.

Claire: Oh, dogs. And we’re back. Alright, guys. I think that’s it for us this week. Thank you for joining us. Don’t forget to check out our sponsor, Ned, helloned.com/JOY or use discount code JOY for 15% off your order. Check them out. And don’t forget, they have a risk-free trial. You can try anything you want for 30 days on their website that you order. Their 30-day risk-free trial is available to all first-time Ned customers. So if you’re not completely satisfied with how their CBD products are impacting you or working in your toolbox, you can return it and you’ll get a refund. It’s fantastic. They’re wonderful. We really love this brand. We love working with them. We love their products. So check them out and thank you for supporting the brands that support our podcast. We will talk to you guys next week. Thank you for being here.

Joy: Bye, guys.

Claire: Bye.

128: Riding the Wave

May 26, 2022 by Joy Parrish Leave a Comment

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This is Joy & Claire Episode 128: Riding the Wave

Episode Date: May 26, 2022

Transcription Completed: July 10, 2022

Audio Length: 46:52 minutes

Joy: Hey guys, this is Joy.

Claire: And this is Claire.

Joy: [laughing] Oh no, what happened?

Claire: My voice is gone. We’re going to try to make this work. I’m moving today, and it snowed, and I lost my voice. Probably from having Covid. We don’t know because I don’t have any tests because they are packed.

Joy: It’s a rollercoaster of things happening all at once.

Claire: Every possible thing that could happen before moving – guys, it’s not supposed to snow. We joke about Colorado could have any weather any day, but May 21st is very late for a snowstorm. I only remember this happening two or three other times in my life. My dad’s birthday is May 20th – happy birthday, John Hay.

Joy: Happy birthday.

Claire: So that day sticks out in my memory. I remember two other times in my life where it has snowed on or near his birthday. So in 35 years, this is only the third time that it’s snowed this late, and it’s on our moving day. Thanks, Mother Nature.

Joy: You’re sick and you’re not feeling great. Just one of those times in life.

Claire: And here we are because we don’t have another time to record and we really want to keep this episode.

Joy: We really want to get an episode out because we’ve been so busy in May, as we’ve mentioned multiple times, and we’ve had all our lovely friends in May to catch up. It’s really early on a Saturday morning. But this is what podcasters that have been doing it for as long as we have that make time to do it, guys. #norestdays.

Claire: #norestdays. A brilliant person on Instagram who is more brilliant than us said that we should have called the May episodes “May I Introduce You To.”

Joy: That’s great.

Claire: I was like, “You’re hired.”

Joy: You’re hired.

Claire: Okay. Let’s start with something funny that happened this week, which is that a reel of Evie went viral.

Joy: Let me just start by adding to that. I don’t ever want to go viral again.

Claire: Never.

Joy: Let me tell you, from the other side guys, it is not fun. You think, oh my gosh, I want my video to go viral. No, you don’t. You absolutely do not.

Claire: You absolutely do not. Okay, so as of this moment – if you guys don’t know what I’m talking about, if you scroll back into our reels. There’s this really random reel. This has nothing to do with our podcast. Where I have this little video of Evie as a baby, and then I have a video of her brutally rejecting me. This happens every morning. So the video, it’s just my life. Here’s the backstory. Brandon leaves for work at 6 in the morning. If you guys don’t know this, he is a nurse. He works in a surgery center. Their first surgery starts at like 7, so he has to be at work at 6:30, so he leaves at 6. By the time the kids are up, he’s long gone. He works four days a week. So there is one day a week that he is home, but it’s a different day every week. It’s always sort of a surprise to the kids which day is dad going to be home. So that’s where this comes from is because every morning when I go to wake Evie up or she’s awake and I go to open her door, she’s like, “Where is my daddy?” And I have to tell her, “He’s at work.” And she’s like, “[screaming] No!” because she’s in a real daddy phase right now. I know these things happen. I don’t take it personally. She’s three. I really don’t take it personally. So I posted a video basically of that. First of all, the first thing that I did was in the intro part, I wrote, “I threw up every day for ten months.” Let me tell you that probably 10,000 people have come for me for the fact that pregnancy is not ten months. There have been knock down dragged out arguments in our comments section about whether or not ten months is accurate. You are just so, so missing the point of this reel.

Joy: You are so missing the point of the reel. I just want to say to anyone out there who is focused on whether it is nine months or ten months, you don’t get to say that unless you’ve had a child. And even if you have and you’re still arguing ten months, I consider pregnancy feeling like it’s ten years. Everyone just needs to shut the hell up.

Claire: By the time you are 40 weeks pregnant, you might as well have been pregnant your whole life. You feel like, “I can never remember a time when I was not this huge.”

Joy: Right. So I’m watching these comments going, I can’t even… it’s like dog years. I’m going to give you seven years times every week that you’re pregnant. Times every week that you’re pregnant, I’m going to add seven years. I was just appalled at the stupidity of that argument.

Claire: The amount of people who are worried about that. I’m like, you just don’t have anything else to worry about? Go argue for women’s reproductive rights in someone’s comments.

Joy: Yeah, let’s put the energy into something else.

Claire: The other thing that was interesting. It’s just been a weird week. We’ve gotten a lot of new followers, which is great. I hope that some of them listen to the podcast. I don’t really know. That’s the thing that is weird about it is that because this reel went viral that really has very little to do with our podcast – We talk about Evie. We talk about parenting. But not a lot.

Joy: Right.

Claire: Or that’s not our number one topic. So anyway, 12 million people have seen that reel. Versus our other reels, a high-performing reel for us will get like 20,000-25,000 views. It’s been a weird week. I wish there was a toggle on your posts where you can put, I don’t want this to show up on the discover page. Because the algorithms just assume that everyone wants to go viral. I don’t ever want to go viral again.

Joy: No. Something I learned from going viral is that you just pull out the armpit of every corner of the internet that comes to you and starts arguing and commenting the most asinine things. So then I was like, you know what, this is why I want to stay an Indie podcast. I never want to get that big to where… pure stupidity. The comments that I was reading were so stupid. Let me be clear, I was not reading every comment. Because you can’t at that point. You get a taste of what celebrities – and we’re not even close to that level – I got a smidge of a taste of what it’s like to be a celebrity. Now I’m like, now I know why they stay off of the comments. Or Taylor Swift just shuts the comments down. It’s a cesspool of negativity, and it’s a waste of time. Yeah, it’s cute and it made people laugh. But at the same time, for anyone out there who is just wanting more followers – no, you don’t guys. It brings out the worst people. It made me so grateful for our little safe corner of the internet. That’s all I want. That’s all I want. I want to stay there. I want to be comfortable with our great people. And that is why we have that little pocket corner of the internet that is just like, “This is just us, guys. Let’s say that way. I don’t need anything else.”

Claire: I think going viral is an introvert’s nightmare. I’m pretty extroverted, but I’ve over the years become less and less outgoing. I will not strike up a conversation with a stranger. I’m fine being in a large group or whatever. I still think that generally speaking I trend towards being an extrovert. But I’ve become less extroverted, especially since I’ve been a parent. My interaction battery is just always really low. I was empathizing with you about that feeling of, I don’t want more people.

Joy: I don’t need more.

Claire: In my sphere. But if you are new here, if you found us from that reel, I really am excited that you are here. I feel like the majority of the people who followed us because of that reel will ultimately end up unfollowing us once they realize that we are not a parenting –

Joy: Right. Or if you think we’re some brilliant comedians or whatever that’s going to constantly produce content.

Claire: I mean, I do consider myself to be a brilliant comedian.

Joy: I think we’re pretty funny. But you know, it will attract the people that need to be here and that connect with us, and that’s great.

Claire: Exactly.

Joy: On that note, as far as episodes and people that connect with us, if you haven’t yet listened to the Kettlebells and Cocktails [00:07:49.12] episode with Nikki Brasier [00:07:50.26] where we were on their podcast, please go listen to it. I loved that episode. I really did. I felt really good recording that, and all the things we talked about were just really honest and true and how we feel about podcasting and kind of the ups and downs that we’ve gone through with podcasting, so you can go listen to that on their feed, Kettlebells and Cocktails. [00:08:08.24]

Claire: Really, we get into the backbone of the palace intrigue of our years of being really tight with the CrossFit HQ folks and what it was like in the early years to be really the only female-hosted podcast in the CrossFit space. Yeah, Nikki [00:08:31.09] is such a good interviewer. It was so fun to be able to talk to her.

Joy: I hope we get to do that again. I hope we do more episodes with her. Well, I know that you’re not feeling great, but do you want to give a quick review of your surfing trip? Which looked amazing.

Claire: Yes. So two weeks ago now – yeah, by the time you guys hear this, it will be 2.5 weeks – I went to Mexico to go surfing with a group called Surf with Amigas. As a lot of you know, I have been obsessed with surfing for no logical reason since I was in middle school. I saw the movie Blue Crush [00:09:02.26] and it really changed my life. Which is a weird thing to say because it’s kind of a bad movie, but here we are. Also the moving Step into Liquid [00:09:07.14], which launched my still present absolute love for Laird Hamilton [00:09:11.01]. He’s just such a babe. So I’ve always been really obsessed with surfing. I’ve always really really wanted to be a surfer. I’ve taken a couple surfing lessons here and there throughout my life, but I never would have described myself as being able to surf. So I finally decided to sign up for this trip. Surf with Amigas is a group that does exactly what it sounds like basically. It’s a group that does small group, most for women but they do have some co-ed trips on their calendar. They have a couple different locations. They have Mexico, Nicaragua, Costa Rica, Panama. I think they have one in Peru. They have one in Morocco. They have one in Indonesia.

Joy: Which by the way, Scott really wants to do one after he saw yours. I haven’t brought this up before, but he has the same dream of learning to surf.

Claire: He does kind of look like Kelly Slater [00:10:01.29].

Joy: He does. He always jokes that people always think he looks like any tall, white, bald man.

Claire: That’s because they all look the same.

Joy: He’s like, “Everyone thinks I look like Woody Harrelson [00:10:12.26].”

Claire: I thought he looked like Kelly Slater [00:10:16.15], to be honest. I feel like that would be a compliment. He’s so funny. Well, he can come with me because Brandon does not want to go.

Joy: So I think that’s next on his bucket list. He was like, “I want to go to that.” I’m like, yeah. Claire can hook you up with that.

Claire: It was so fun. So this one was outside Puerto Verta [00:10:33.19]. If you’re familiar with that area, it was just north of Sailita [00:10:34.13]. Which I didn’t really realize that Sailita [00:10:37.01] is really popular. It’s a really cute little town. We were just north of Sailita [00:10:41.28] in a little town called San Pancho [00:10:42.19]. I didn’t know anyone else who was going. The whole group was seven people plus two main instructors who were with us sort of the whole time. And then a couple more instructors were joining us for our actual surfing. So here was a day in the life. Because of the way the tides were, we had to surf really early in the morning. So we wake up, have first breakfast at 6, we go surfing from 6:30-11:30. We would drive there and get all of our stuff, so we would actually be in the water from probably 7:30/8 to 10:30/11, which is kind of a long time to be surfing if you don’t know what you’re doing. We were at this really cute place with pretty small waves. The whole thing about surfing that I came to find is that my group was a whole range of abilities. I was definitely the lowest ability, and then there were a couple people there who – two in particular – who are from Wilmington, North Carolina [00:11:26.05] and they surf quite a lot. So there were just kind of there. It was a mom and daughter, which was so cute. And they were just kind of there to have a fun mom and daughter trip. But they were very good at surfing. But the cool thing about surfing is that even if it’s small waves, you can still have a lot of fun as an advanced surfer on the same kind of waves that a beginner is still learning on. That made it kind of fun. We were all out there, and the more advanced people were catching way more waves and riding them for longer and actually popping up.

Joy: Got it. I was wondering, does it matter the size of the wave?

Claire: It definitely does. And I think eventually those more advanced people would want a little more variety. But for the purposes of this trip – okay, so paddling out, so tired. No amount of working out would have prepared me for this. Imagine being in Cobra [00:12:14.03] and paddling.

Joy: Oh yeah, your posterior chain [00:12:18.17]. So many supermans. [00:12:21.26]

Claire: Yeah. But then your arms.

Joy: Ugh.

Claire: There’s water getting in your face.

Joy: I can only imagine. I’m sore thinking about it.

Claire: By the time you get out there, if you don’t know what you’re doing, you’re just exhausted. There was one other girl there named Lily. She and I kind of hung out together as the less experienced surfers. We would always be like, imagine getting out here and just feeling ready to catch a wave and not needing to recover just from paddling out.

Joy: Oh my gosh, no wonder surfers are in such good shape. They are all just jacked. Like Laird Hamilton [00:12:56.23]. No wonder you had a crush on Laird Hamilton. [00:12:56.23]

Claire: By the time you get out into the lineup, if you’re brand new, you’re exhausted. So you kind of just sit there and bob around for a little while while you wait for your heart rate to go down.

Joy: You’re like, “That was fun. I’m done.”

Claire: Exactly. So I was like, my goal is just to paddle out every day. That’s all I have to do. If I get out here, great. Then the instructors that we had with us were so great. All of them were so wonderful. They would physically push you into the wave. Because by that time, your arms are just so weak and tiny.

Joy: We’re going to help you out here. Throw you a bone.

Claire: So reading the water is also a skill that is earned over time.

Joy: Okay.

Claire: As the waves come in, not every wave is going to wave. And you’re not going to be in the right spot for every wave. At least at this location where we were. To they are helping you figure out, “Okay, that’s not a good one, that’s not a good one. Here comes a good one. Start paddling.” You awkwardly turn your board around and awkwardly lay down like a walrus and awkwardly try to paddle, even though you feel like you are absolutely not moving at all. And then they would shove the back of your board right as the wave was picking up to help you get a little bit of momentum. Then you are laying there like a walrus and you feel, not unlike a walrus, I physically cannot stand up. But that’s your task is to stand up.

Joy: That’s all you got to do, yeah.

Claire: You’re supposed to do this thing. It’s called a pop up. You’re supposed to pop up.

Joy: Yeah. I’ve seen – what movie… oh, Point Break [00:14:15.28] where they are trying to teach Keanu Reeves [00:14:19.08] how to surf.

Claire: Yeah. And it’s really hard when you’re out there because your board is pretty wobbly. You have to find the center of balance. You’re trying to stand up.

Joy: It’s like probably trying to go from laying down to jumping up on a Bose ball [00:14:33.29].

Claire: It’s like doing a burpee. It’s exactly like a burpee except that you’re trying to land with your feet laterally and on a balance board.

Joy: Oh yeah.

Claire: Very hard. So what I was doing was not popping up. I would go into a lunge. Then I’d bring my back foot over. Then I’d sort of test it out and see if I was going to be good. At that point, 90% of the time I would fall. So I would test it out and it would be bad. I would fail the test. But a couple of times I stood up. At this particular point, the waves were not very long. So by the time I would stand up, typically the wave would pretty much be over. [laughing]

Joy: You’re like, aw man. There’s a timing aspect to this too where everything ha store be perfectly timed. The wave is not going to wait for you.

Claire: Exactly. When the waves were a little bit smaller, you really needed to be able to pop up. Because otherwise the wave is going to end before you have the chance to do anything. That was a big factor for me. I spent a lot of time trying to stand up. And then by the end, the wave is done. I did get a couple rides. It was so fun. I have probably never had so much fun doing something in my whole life. When you are out there floating around, it’s just so relaxing and so peaceful. Peaceful is not even the right word because it’s not tranquil. But it’s one of those activities… how do I even start this?

Joy: Okay, can I offer perhaps a somewhat similar experience? Remember in Costa Rica when we went paddle boarding and we all paddled so far out?

Claire: Yeah, accidentally paddled miles away from the shore.

Joy: Totally, accidentally. First of all, I love that when we showed up, the people who were giving us the paddle boards –

Claire: The board rental guys were like, “Wow.”

Joy: Could not have cared less if we came back. I’m pretty sure if we had never returned, they would not have cared. I think when we returned, they weren’t even there. We were just like, well, hopefully all of our stuff isn’t gone when we get there. Not meaning that they would steal it, but we just didn’t have any place to put our stuff. We were so far out. I just remember that being so funny where we were like, I don’t even think the people who rented us those paddle boards even cared if we returned.

Claire: Or even remembered that we had rented them.

Joy: Exactly. I think when we returned, we were like, “Here is your paddle board back.”

Claire: Because we were like out to sea for a moment there.

Joy: I just remember being really scared because it was getting dark. I was like, I don’t want to be out here in the dark, I’m sorry. But remember when we were all sitting out there and just kind of floating around, it was so peaceful. Was it kind of like that?

Claire: Yeah. Or it was kind of like rock climbing or other similar types of activities where the actual amount of time you spend actually climbing or actually surfing is kind of low compared to the amount of time you spend getting ready or hiking up there or paddling out there or kind of hanging out with your friends while you prepare to do it. But like if you’re rock climbing and you’re a beginner/intermediate, the actual amount of time you spend on the rock, the proportion is not that high compared to what you are doing the rest of the day. But it still holds your attention just enough that you can’t worry about other things.

Joy: Right. Love that. I love those activities.

Claire: And so that’s really the key is that you’re out there. You obviously can’t have your phone because you’re floating in the ocean. You’re paying attention to what’s happening because the second you stop paying attention, an outside wave is going to come and hit you in the head. So you’re keeping your wits about you enough that it’s occupying your thoughts. Just at this low-level hump. It’s very regulating. Part of me feels like this takes us back to early human brain activity where our lives were spent doing these very predictable actives with a low-level hum of awareness of our surroundings. That taps into something very regulating. So that was just how I spent two or three hours every morning. You’re out there. You’re doing something. I love being in the water. There was a sea turtle one day.

Joy: Oh my God.

Claire: Let me tell you the story about the sea turtle.

Joy: I love it.

Claire: I had to paddle back in to put more sunscreen on. Which is kind of the kiss of death. Because as we discussed, paddling, not my strong suit. The idea of paddling back out was like, oh God.

Joy: Yeah.

Claire: And that’s the other problem guys. Once you catch a wave, if you fall or even if you get a great ride, you’re like, oh God, now I’ve got to paddle back.

Joy: Now you’ve got to go back. Yeah. It would be like skiing with no ski lift.

Claire: I was just thinking, what is the ski lift of surfing? Can I get a pully situation out here?

Joy: Yep.

Claire: I was like, okay, here we go. I’m going to paddle. So I start paddling. And I would do this thing where I would give myself ten paddles. I would count to ten, and then I would rest. Then I would do ten more, and then I’d rest. I finally get out there. I’m like ten paddles away from the group, and I am just out of steam. I put my head down on my board, and I hear this [sound effect], and this little sea turtle head surfaced like six feet away from me.

Joy: Sorry. I don’t know anything cuter than a little sea turtle head coming out of the water.

Claire: Not at all. I felt like Moana.

Joy: They’re so cute. They’re so cute. Their little heads just pop out of the water. It’s the cutest thing.

Claire: It was the best. It was like the sea turtle was like, “[sound effect] You got this. Ten more paddles.” And I was like, “You’re right, sea turtle.” And then I got out there –

Joy: Little spirit sea turtle coming out.

Claire: My little sea turtle of encouragement. Got out to the lineup and a couple minutes later, saw him again poke his little head up like, “Okay, you made it. I’m going to go now.”

Joy: I’ve helped you to your destiny. Oh my gosh, that’s just the cutest thing ever.

Claire: The sea turtle of encouragement. And there was a wale that we saw breaching way out in the distance. There were little yellow fishes all around. We saw a crocodile. Right where we were surfing, there was a freshwater river that came into the ocean and this little lagoon, and there was a crocodile back there. So that was fun. Stopped bringing the dogs with us after that. [00:20:15.22]

Joy: Are they a danger to you guys?

Claire: No. I mean, if I were to go swimming in that lagoon, maybe. But it wouldn’t come out into the ocean.

Joy: Got it, got it, got it.

Claire: What other fun wildlife did we see? I think the biggest thing for me about this trip though. First of all, very validating. Surfing is so fun. I absolutely love it. I want to do it all the time. I got back home, and I was physically withdrawing from surfing. I was physically uncomfortable with not being able to go surfing. I missed being able to surf more than I had missed my family while I was away.

Joy: Red flag.

Claire: I was like, maybe I’ll just go to Mexico. And there were also a couple of people were like, “Oh, were there cartels?” [00:21:01.10] I feel like the cartel story is really [00:21:06.10] overexaggerated to Americans. I think it’s one of those things where people are like, “Some areas are really dangerous.” Well, some areas in the US are dangerous too. I felt really safe the whole time.

Joy: I’m sending you a link. We’re doing real-time link sharing. I just thought of this when you were talking about it. I actually have something on my bucket list that, life goals, would like to do. Because it’s with Gabby Reese [00:21:31.15] and her husband Laird Hamilton [00:21:33.08]. They do these retreats that are a thousand million dollars.

Claire: Do you understand that I would not be able to function on this retreat?

Joy: Well, I mean, okay. If everybody wants to go see it, it’s xptlife.com. They do these retreats a couple times a year. It’s all about pushing your physical limits, doing cold water immersion.

Claire: It’s $6,500 for three days? [00:22:00.01]

Joy: It’s so expensive. Someone, can you please sponsor us to go? I want to go to the one in Malibu. If I had no financial limits and could do anything, I would one thousand percent do the XPT Life. [00:22:12.13]

Claire: That doesn’t even include flights. And it’s actually only 2.5 days.

Joy: [laughing] Why is it so expensive?

Claire: Lunch, dinner. It doesn’t include breakfast?

Joy: Hey, Laird, Gabby [00:22:27.15], call us. Maybe they will sponsor the podcast, and we will do this.

Claire: Oh my gosh. “Don’t be intimidated. The XPT experience is created to suit all fitness levels. You do not need to be a world-class athlete.” Thank God. I mean, I would pay $6,500 to meet Laird Hamilton [00:22:40.11].

Joy: I would pay $6,500 to just hang out with them for two days and have them train us. That would be worth it to me. And to be in Malibu. They also have one in Costa Rica, but I’m like, take me to Malibu.

Claire: At least you can fly to Malibu for not another –

Joy: $6,500.

Claire: Bless these people. Okay. What I want to get to is my takeaway. Which first of all is, yes, surfing is the best and I want to do it all the time. But second of all, I was pretty nervous to go on this because I feel like there is some stigma around moms taking time for themselves. To me, this felt like a radical amount of time. I left for an entire week. I was gone Saturday to Saturday with very little contact. I get international service, but it’s terrible. Joy, you know. Any time we’ve ever traveled, my phone is basically useless. I don’t know why. I don’t travel internationally enough to figure it out. I really can only function when I’m on wifi. I had a lot of self-doubt around doing this for a full week. In my mind, I was like, a long weekend is one thing to sort of abandon your family – this is my self-talk, right. I’m abandoning my family. Brandon was so great. He was the first person to really encourage me to do this. He was like, “I know how much you always wanted to do something like this. I think you should go for it. I’ll figure it out.” And I drew the line of, okay, if I’m going to do this, I don’t want to be in charge of anything at home for that week. I don’t want to be the one coordinating backup care. I don’t want to be the one figuring out your meal plan for that week. I want to be able to truly go.

Joy: Truly unplug and not to be worrying about things at home.

Claire: Right. And not being the one getting texts from my mom saying, “Hey, who is picking up Miles today?”

Joy: Right. Right, right.

Claire: Because in the past when I’ve traveled for work, a lot of the times I have still been the one to coordinate those logistics. I’ll send a spreadsheet and a 10,000-word email before I leave of, okay guys, here is almost an hour-to-hour itinerary of the whole week while I’m gone of where the kids are going to be and who is doing pick up and drop off. Because again as I mentioned with Brandon leaving for work early, his work schedule is not flexible. So someone else has to manage the pickups and the drop offs. He was totally fine with that. He was like, “I got this.” And he did. The only thing that happened – and I have to tell this story. Miles’ kindergarten concert was on the Monday that I was gone. I was like, okay Brandon. Two things. He has to wear his elementary school t-shirt. And send me videos. So I get these videos, and I’m like, “Where is Miles in the video? He’s not in the video.” He’s like, “He’s in the middle in the back.” That’s not Miles.

Joy: [laughing]

Claire: Brandon took videos of the whole entire concert of the wrong kid thinking it was Miles.

Joy: To be fair, guys, Claire sent me this video and the kid does look a lot like Miles. If it was my kid, I think I would know which one was my kid.

Claire: That’s the thing. If you have heard a description of Miles, yeah. Tall-ish. He’s tall for being six. He’s got light brown, blonde hair.

Joy: Short.

Claire: Short, yeah. From a distance if you did not know this kid, you could be like, “That might be him.”

Joy: Yeah.

Claire: If you have lived with him every day of his life – like the moment I saw the video, I was like, “That’s not Miles.” Just the way that he’s moving and his face, the way it moves when he was speaking. Miles was in the very front row. Sitting on the floor, front row. In a bright blue polo shirt, not in his school shirt. So not only did Brandon take a video of the wrong kid, but he should have known Miles didn’t even have that shirt on. So part of me is like, did Brandon take a video of this kid and send it to me thinking I wouldn’t notice and hoping that I wouldn’t catch the fact that he forgot the shirt. So Brandon took videos of the wrong kid during the kindergarten concert.

Joy: It’s so good.

Claire: I don’t even know what kid it is.

Joy: Did Brandon finally fess up?

Claire: His response was, “Well, he looks like Miles.” I was like, okay.

Joy: [laughing] Samesies.

Claire: And I was Facetiming with him, and I was like, “You had one job.” He was like, “Claire, you’re at a beach right now.” I was like, “Touché. Okay, bye.” [laughing] So I kind of let it go.

Joy: Give it some grace. Give it some grace.

Claire: He go there. It’s fine. But I’m probably never going to let him live that down. “Remember that time you took videos of the wrong kid?”

Joy: It’s so funny. It’s so funny. It’s so great.

Claire: So I felt really…

Joy: You felt totally unplugged.

Claire: Unplugged. Like, really disconnected. The way that this retreat was set up was I didn’t have to do anything. I didn’t even know the name of our hotel. I just got myself on a flight to Puerto Verta [00:26:51.21], which was direct from Denver. And I just showed up. I didn’t have to plan anything, I didn’t have to worry about where I was going to get my meals. I didn’t have to go arrange for transportation.

Joy: It’s like when we did our trips. It’s the best. You don’t have to think about anything.

Claire: Yeah. And I know you talked about this a couple weeks ago about having this fear of, oh, I don’t want to be this tourist. But every time I’ve done a group travel thing, I’ve actually felt less like a tourist because you’re with someone typically who lives there.

Joy: Right. Right. That’s why I liked our trips because we have people that are showing us the behind-the-scenes stuff. Like the ice cream house where the lady sells ice cream from her house.

Claire: Exactly.

Joy: That’s the best.

Claire: And yeah, you’re traveling in a group of 10 white people, so it’s pretty obvious. I’m going to stick out anywhere I go unless I go to the northern UK. So I have come to really love adult group travel because you just show up. That to me is a true vacation where you really don’t have to plan anything. You’re not spending weeks trying to book Airbnb’s. Some people love that process. I am not in a phase in my life where I want to add any additional logistics planning into my life.

Joy: Totally agree.

Claire: But I think the coolest thing about this trip was that all of the women there were so supportive. As soon as they found out that I had young kids, I did not even get a single whiff of someone being like, “Oh, who is watching your kids?” I feel like that is such a common thing that people say. I don’t think that they necessarily mean it in a bad way, but it can feel so judgy. Someone being like, “Oh, you’re here? Who is watching your kids?” Well, my partner. It just insinuates that –

Joy: Who is watching your kids?

Claire: It insinuates that you just left your kids in a parking lot and have gone to the beach. “Oh no, the children! Who is watching them?” That question to me is so patriarchal. And I didn’t even get a whiff of that. In fact, when I got picked up by the shuttle, I was in the shuttle with the mom and daughter group that was there, and they were so adorable. And the mom, I said, “Oh yeah, I’m from the Denver area, and I have a 3- and a 6-year-old.” The first words out of her mouth were, “Good for you. I’m proud of you.” That just set the tone for the whole week.

Joy: Oh my gosh.

Claire: Good for me.

Joy: That would be my first reaction. Good for you for taking some time for yourself. Bravo.

Claire: And that was everyone’s reaction. They were like, “Go take a nap.” Everyone was so amazingly supportive and so looking out for me for really maximizing the time.

Joy: Take advantage of every moment, yeah.

Claire: So it was so great. I haven’t described the whole second half of the day. But suffice it to say, they made me do yoga. And I loved it because let me tell you what the yoga was. It was this woman named Riselle [00:29:23.27]. The way that she talked was like this, “On your next inhalation, roll to the other side. And on your next exhalation, you will bring your knees to your chest or put your arms out to the letter ‘T.’” I’m not exaggerating when I tell you that everyone fell asleep in yoga every day.

Joy: Oh, that’s amazing. [laughing]

Claire: She would have us do like on down dog, and we were like, “We don’t want any more down dog.” So almost every time, we were just on our backs every time. Literally the poses were like, lay there with your arms out to the side and move your arms into cactus arms. Inhale, cactus arms. But you’re laying down. Like, that’s the new pose. And then you hold that for like three minutes.

Joy: Oh yeah. It was like pure restorative yoga, which is the best.

Claire: It was basically a moving nap.

Joy: Oh yeah.

Claire: It was truly amazing. Ten out of ten on that yoga.

Joy: It reminds me of – okay, I know I keep talking about Costa Rica. But it reminds me of when Lous [00:30:17.06] taught our yoga class, and she was so cute. Whenever she would say something, she’s be like, “Uh huh” every move? “Like this, uh huh.”

Claire: So cute.

Joy: So cute. To this day, I think she may be the cutest person I’ve ever met in real life.

Claire: Agree. So highly recommend Surf with Amigas. [00:30:33.18]

Joy: Highly recommend.

Claire: And I want to go back. I would do this exact trip again. It’s so easy to get to Puerto Verta [00:30:40.03] and this area we were in was only an hour north of Puerto Verta [00:30:41.17]. It was very easy to access.

Joy: Oh awesome. And what was the name again?

Claire: Of what?

Joy: The trip.

Claire: Surf with Amigas. If anyone who went on the trip is listening, you guys are the best. Thanks for supporting me. Thanks for letting me be a beginner. That’s a whole other angle that we’ll talk about a different time of showing up knowing you’re going to be the worst at something. No one made fun of my wet suit. I wore it every day. I ended up not wearing the hat. I did the first day, but because of my inability to paddle, it was really obstructing my vision. So I just wore a lot of sunscreen on my forehead.

Joy: Yeah, I can imagine that would be hard.

Claire: I was actually so glad I had that wetsuit. Because otherwise I would have had to reapply sunscreen so much. I only got sunburned once.

Joy: Good for you. That’s not an easy thing to avoid.

Claire: No. It’s because of my wetsuit.

Joy: Perfect. Well, we’re very excited for you, and I’m so proud of you. I know that was a lot of facing fears and doing big things and being away from your family. I loved all the feedback that everyone gave on Instagram where they’re like, “I’m so excited for you. This is so inspiring.”

Claire: Oh my gosh, I loved that. The amount of encouragement that I got on Instagram from the people who follow us. Everyone’s like, “This makes me so happy for you.” “I love that you did this.” Everyone who commented or sent us DM’s who were excited for me, your excitement for me feels so special. It feels so supportive in that you guys really get me. So thanks to everyone who sent notes of excitement. Because when you do something that you’ve been wanting to do for a long time and other people see how cool that is, it feels very validating.

Joy: It’s super validating. So cool. Well let’s take a quick break and talk about our sponsors for this week, Ned, our favorite sponsors and the favorite CBD products out there. May is mental health month, and I want to take a moment to share the ways that I use CBD and I use Ned’s Destress Blend. Lately I’ve been feeling really down. I don’t know what’s going on with my mood. I do take medication for mood stabilization, but I’ve been really feeling, for whatever reason, and I’m not even going to try to overanalyze it, but I’m just feeling really crappy and I don’t know why. Using some of the Destress Blend throughout the day is giving me this calm. Because what I tend to do is if I’m feeling down, I get made about feeling down. So I’ve been using more of the Ned’s Destress Blend throughout the day, which is really evening out my mood, making me feel calm. So I just wanted to share that because I feel like there’s so many times when we go through hard times and feel difficult emotions. Sometimes it just kind of comes out of nowhere. I’ve been using that and it’s just a part of my self-care that I really, really appreciate. I’m so glad. Not only is Ned just a great sponsor, but they have great products and we’re so grateful they are our sponsor. We truly feel passionate about their products. So please support our podcast by supporting the great sponsor, Ned. Invest in yourself and fortify your stress response this month. Get 15% off Ned’s Destress Blend with code JOY. Go to helloned.com/JOY or enter code JOY at checkout. That’s helloned.com/JOY to get 15% off. Thank you, Ned, for sponsoring the show and offering our listeners a natural remedy for some of life’s most common health issues.

Claire: And I think one thing that we have been talking a lot about this month is having a whole toolbox of things to use to support your mental health. You’re never going to hear from us that any one thing is going to be the silver bullet. Because mental health is so complex. For us, we both use CBD as a way to support a lot of the other things that we do. But it does really help maintain a more stable baseline. That is really the thing that I have found. In the same way that I have described antidepressants or antianxiety as they don’t solve your problem, but they pull you out of the river. Similarly, I feel like Ned, to a slightly lesser degree, just helps take off the edge. The CBD products when I use them over the course of a couple hours start to feel like, okay, whatever this stress was that I was feeling was absolutely insurmountable is suddenly feeling less insurmountable. It really helps take that edge off and get you over the hump. So I definitely recommend checking it out, adding it to your toolbox. We just love Ned. You guys know we love how high quality their products are. Thank you, guys, for supporting the brands that support our podcast.

Joy: Alright, do we want to end with some really quick questions?

Claire: Yes, please.

Joy: Okay. What really burns your biscuits, Claire?

Claire: So many things. People who leave stupid comments on Instagram reels.

Joy: [laughing] Did any of that get under your skin?

Claire: I stopped reading them.

Joy: Okay, good. Because I don’t see you as someone who would let that stuff get to you, but after so many.

Claire: I haven’t read them in days because there’s so many. Every once in a while, I sort of out of the corner of my eye seen a really stupid one, and then I just delete it. I don’t know these people. I don’t owe them anything. This is just some idiot troll. Broader speaking, what burns my biscuits? I get really, really, really annoyed when people insist that they are going to do something and then never do it. I’m like, listen. Just tell me. If you can’t do something, just say you can’t do it. It’s fine. And this is at work or maybe a friend. And you’re like, if you can’t do it, I’m not going to get mad at you. Just tell me that you don’t have time. Don’t make me continue waiting for you to do this thing for it to never get done.

Joy: A work thing or just anything?

Claire: A work thing. Or maybe a friend is going to bring something over or let you borrow something. I don’t know. I can’t think of an example.

Joy: Like a lack of follow through?

Claire: Lack of follow through. And then when you say, “Hey, are you still going to do X, Y, Z? Because no big deal, but if not I’m either going to go ask someone else to do it or do it myself.”

Joy: Right, right.

Claire: “No, no, no. I’m going to do it.” And you’re like, okay… and so now it feels like if you go out and do it yourself or find someone else to do it, it’s going to be a thing. But you also know in the back of your mind, they’re not actually going to do it. That makes me crazy. When people just are no tup front. Like, “Hey, I can’t get this done. I’m so sorry. I thought I was going to be able to, but something came up. Go ahead and find someone else to do it.”

Joy: I wonder if they have a hard time saying no.

Claire: I’m sure that’s what it is. But it just makes me crazy. This is not specific to any one person.

Joy: Yeah, yeah, yeah. You’re not being passive aggressive. [laughing] I am the same. I would say that very similarly, one of my good friends who doesn’t listen to the podcast – but if she does, she knows this because I’ve told her – is she overcommits. And then she always cancels plans. I’m like, just don’t overcommit. Just don’t do it if you know you can’t do it. It just goes back to she has a hard time saying “no.” So I call her out on that all the time, and it drives me crazy. Don’t overcommit. So when she’ll come to town, she’ll be like, “Let’s do this, this, and this.” I’m like, alright. Tell me one thing that you might be able to do because I know at this point that you’re going to cancel all of it. Just tell me one thing that you possibly could do, and I have zero expectations that when she does come to town that I’ll even see her. If I see you, great. But don’t overcommit. It drives me crazy. Drives me nuts.

Claire: One thing I was talking about with someone recently around overcommitting and saying “no” is that I think or a lot of us we think if we say “no” to things, it will cast us in a light as someone – like ultimately it will lead to people not wanting to ask us to do things because they will think, “Oh, they’re just going to say ‘no.’” It paints us as someone who is not willing to help or who only will do things that are to the letter to their job description at work. When in reality, I found the opposite to be true. Which I have a reputation of being someone who will only say “yes” if I truly can take it on. That has created a reputation where people ask me way more and for much larger commitments because they know they can trust me to be honest with them about whether or not I can fully execute it.

Joy: Right. Right.

Claire: So rather than becoming someone having a reputation for saying “no” and then people not wanting to ask me, people come to me and say, “I’m only asking you this because I know that if you can’t do it, you will actually say ‘no.’” So hot tip.

Joy: And saying “no” isn’t like you’re just going to be a “no” person. It’s just I don’t have the time for this right now.

Claire: But I think that’s what people think. The second I start saying “no,” people are going to see me as disagreeable to not wanting to help. I have found the opposite in a really productive way. So if anyone out there is worried about it, give it a shot.

Joy: Don’t be worried about it. What are your top favorite beverages?

Claire: Coffee. Iced coffee. Hot coffee.

Joy: Are you still an iced coffee person? Do you drink iced coffee every single day or hot coffee?

Claire: No, I drink hot coffee because that’s what Brandon makes. And I like cold brew, but I don’t like iced drip coffee. It just waters it down. I love [00:39:27.04] aura bora still. I had a new type of hibiscus aura bora last night [00:39:26.11].

Joy: Oh aura bora [00:39:29.16], so good.

Claire: I love Hop Tea. [00:39:29.16] Those are the main ones. And then my favorite alcoholic beverage. I’ve really moved away from alcohol this year. Just never feels good in my body. But I well-timed margarita is really hard to beat.

Joy: I will go with GT Synergy kombucha will forever be my favorite kombucha. It’s so good, so fizzy, so punchy. I love a punchy kombucha.

Claire: Yeah, I don’t like GT. It’s too vinegary for me. But that’s what you like about it.

Joy: That’s what I like about it. I don’t like a sweet kombucha. I also have a friend that calls it “kambucha.” I refuse to correct her. “I like ‘kambucha.’” I do love the Gingerade and the Trilogy, but I will go for any flavor. Trader Joe’s has a flavor that they exclusively carry. It’s Strawberry Lemonade. It’s so good. I think I need to go get some for myself today. And then I have been really – so since the end of January, I have cut out alcohol pretty much altogether. So I got on this train of finding really good hop waters, hop teas, or non-alcoholic beers. I’m not on this really strict train of zero alcohol, but I’m just trying to cut it out because I too don’t feel good.

Claire: We’ve talked about this. There’s a line between sobriety and what that entails and the journey that that invokes. Versus choosing to rarely drink alcohol.

Joy: Right. There’s different levels to that, so I don’t want to be categorizing myself on the sober journey because I think there’s so much more to that. We talked about that on another episode. But I have just made the choice to take alcohol from my repertoire. It doesn’t make me feel good. So I have been on this journey. It’s kind of fun. It’s a fun game for me because I really do enjoy the taste of beer. I’ve found a couple brands that I super love. One is Untitled Art. They do sell it at some of the liquor stores. I find it really hilarious that they sell non-alcoholic beers – you have to go to a liquor store most of the time. I think Whole Foods started selling some brands. Untitled Art is one of the brands that I love. The Westcoast IPA Untitled Art non-alcoholic beer is really good. And then there’s a brand called Athletic Brewery. Really, really good as well. And Costco’s liquor store sells the Athletic Brewery beers, and I really, really like those. So I’ve been enjoying those beverages in the afternoon. I do like coffee too. I’ll do a fizzy water, a Zevia [00:42:10.03], every once in a while. But those are my go-tos right now. Alright, last one.

Claire: I just want you guys to know that every time we try to record, we’re like, “Let’s keep it to 45 minutes,” and it literally never –

Joy: Never happens.

Claire: Like, the movers are going to be here in a half hour.

Joy: I know. Okay, let’s finish with that.

Claire: Let’s do one more. I want to do one more. This is the problem is that when it comes to boundaries, my worst boundary to keep is keeping this podcast to 45 minutes.

Joy: I know.

Claire: I just want to keep talking.

Joy: Always. Okay. What is a favorite hobby that you would like to do more of?

Claire: Well surfing is the obvious answer for me today. And I really am looking forward to getting back to baking. I feel like I haven’t been baking as much.

Joy: Yeah, you haven’t been baking.

Claire: This winter was a really busy season with me with my new job and going into work more. I want to get back to doing more baking again.

Joy: I love that. I love that story. Gosh. A hobby that I would like to do more of? I don’t know. Podcasting. Podcasting. I love podcasting. I don’t want to say anything exercise related because that sounds boring, but I do still have it in my heart to start up CrossFit again or do some type of more strength training classes to go to a class and be in that community. We talked a little bit about that on the Kettle Bells and Cocktails [00:43:35.13] podcast episode of why that’s something that I’m feeling more drawn to.

Claire: I agree. We talked about this on Kettlebells and Cocktails [00:43:42.06]. I wish there was a gym near me that I really liked. I miss going to Roots. Anyone listening from Roots, I miss you guys. I wish my life took me to Boulder more now.

Joy: I want to know this too. I’m going to put this on – let me see, hold on. Anyone listening to the podcast goes to CrossFit Lakewood, can you give me shout out and let me know if you like that gym? Because it is less than a mile from my house, and that feels like –

Claire: Oh.

Joy: And I know I feel a little bit of a betrayal to the CrossFit gym I was going to –

Claire: Rocky Mountain Athletics.

Joy: But I’m looking for the easiest, closest, least amount of driving effort. I am at a point where if it is less than a mile, I’m in. The gym has got to be good. So if anyone listening goes to CrossFit Lakewood, will you please message me? Thank you, thank you. Okay, you’ve got to go move. You’ve got things to do.

Claire: My recording set up is the last thing – do you see around my room?

Joy: Yeah, I was going to say it’s pretty empty.

Claire: The shelves are gone. My whole house is in boxes. Except I was like, “Leave the microphone.”

Joy: Yeah.

Claire: Guys, podcasting is serious business.

Joy: It really is.

Claire: It’s a priority.

Joy: We’re not kidding when we say we make it happen. Okay, go move.

Claire: Wish me luck.

Joy: I hope you feel better. I hope you don’t have Covid. I hope it stops snowing this freaking week.

Claire: All of the above.

Joy: Is something in retrograde?

Claire: I really did not get a honeymoon phase after this vacation. There was no halo.

Joy: No.

Claire: Right into the world. Thank you, guys, for listening. Don’t forget to check out our sponsor, Ned. That’s helloned.com/JOY or use discount code JOY for 15% off your order. Try out their Destress Blend. Take the edge off of the stressors in your life and add that as a tool to your mental health toolkit. I’m just going to say it one time because I love it. Don’t forget to utilize your cannabinoids. That was with my gravelly voice. Cannabinoids.

Joy: Yes. Your sexy phlegm.

Claire: Oh yeah, sexy phlegm. Alright guys, we’ll talk to you next week. You can find us on Instagram @joyandclaire_. Check out our new website joyandclaire.com.

Joy: It’s so cute.

Claire: It’s so cute, I love it. And for all your branding needs – this is not an ad. She has not asked us to do this. But we really loved working with Rachel from Reach Creative [00:45:56.13]. She really understood the assignment. She went back, listened to all our old episodes – not all, but a lot of old episodes. She was so, so, so great to work with. She really went so many extra miles to understand who we were and what we wanted, and it just turned out so great.

Joy: Reach Creative. [00:46:15.11] You said it really fast, so I wanted to make sure.

Joy and Claire: Rachel from Reach Creative.

Claire: Highly recommend. Thank you, guys. Talk to you soon. Bye.

Joy: Bye.

124: Is It Helpful or Hurtful?

April 28, 2022 by Joy Parrish Leave a Comment

Underrated TV characters, Joy’s love for Selling Sunset and Married at First Sight, Claire is on her way to Mexico, Miles wins a karate tournament, Joy gives a Joe update, and Joy opens up about her previous job ending.

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This is Joy & Claire Episode 124: Is It Helpful or Hurtful?

Episode Date: April 28, 2022

Transcription Completed: June 8, 2022

Audio Length: 63:09 minutes

Joy: Hey guys, this is Joy.

Claire: And this is Claire.

Joy: Welcome back. It’s almost May.

Claire: It’s gonna be May.

Joy: So great.

Claire: It never gets old. Never. I will never not repost that meme. It’s my favorite.

Joy: Do you know the origin on that? Like who started it?

Claire: Are you kidding?

Joy: Oh no. Who came up with the meme of it?

Claire: Oh, no. I don’t know. They should win a prize. An internet prize. I think any time you create something on the internet that is still relevant more than five years after you created it, you should win a prize.

Joy: I agree.

Claire: Also, we’re recording this on Monday, and today is April 25, which is light jacket day.

Joy: It’s the best. I love that movie so much.

Claire: “All you need is a light jacket.” I think I might try to do a reel later about the light jacket.

Joy: That’s so great. She’s one of the best characters.

Claire: She really is. “That’s a tough one. I have to say April 25th.”

Joy: If you think about the people who have really nailed characters, she’s such a good one.

Claire: Okay, let’s have a conversation quickly about underrated non-main characters.

Joy: Oh. Don’t even get me started.

Claire: I am getting you started. That’s the purpose of the question.

Joy: I have two off the top of my head. If anybody is new to Abbott Elementary, the sitcom. It’s on ABC. It is written by Quinta Brunson. She is a comedian. I listened to an interview she did on NPR with Terry Gross. I believe the inspiration was her mom was a teacher. It’s a group of teachers, and they find themselves in this Philadelphia public school. Not a lot of money. So how they help the students succeed. But it is shot very much Office-style where you have people looking at the camera shooting their head. Really, really, really funny. The main character is Quinta Brunson’s character. She’s a teacher. But the comedian who plays the principal, her name is Janelle James. Her character is Ava Coleman. I can’t explain it. There’s no words to explain how funny she is. It is top notch, probably one of my top five hidden gem characters. If you have not watched that show, please watch it. They do air the show on Hulu if you don’t watch it on ABC. That is one.

Claire: My favorite hidden gem character – it isn’t really a hidden gem. I feel like this whole media is a hidden gem. Is Hank Azaria’s character in Birdcage.

Joy: Yes.

Claire: Agador.

Joy: I know you do love Birdcage.

Claire: “I do not wear shoes because they make me fall down.”

Joy: And then were we texting recently about the Father of the Bride?

Claire: Yes, we did. I was in a corporate training where somebody instead of say “advocacy” was say “ad-VOC-acy.” All it made me think of was Martin Short’s character.

Joy: Oh God. I love when he’s like, “Let’s talk about the menu.” And Steve Martin is like, “The menu… the menu…”

Claire: “Every party has a pooper. That’s why we invited you, party pooper George Banks.”

Joy: [laughing] George Banks. I love him so much. My favorite though, [high pitched sounds].

Claire: [high pitched sounds] He’s so good.

Joy: He’s so good. But let’s talk also about how he was playing a gay character back when gay characters weren’t very mainstream. It’s so interesting to look back now. I just thought that was the best character ever. Anyway, you could go down many trails.

Claire: Right. I mean, same thing with the Birdcage.

Joy: Right.

Claire: Although, it was supposed to be drag, which I think they did. I mean, that whole movie, I love it so much.

Joy: But even on Modern Family, they have straight people playing a gay character. It was in the late 80’s, early 90’s. It was a different time. And very flamboyant. And you think of My Best Friend’s Wedding where Hugh Jackman – is it Hugh Jackman that was her best friend? No, no, no, not the one who was getting married.

Claire: Was that Hugh Jackman?

Joy: No, it wasn’t Hugh Jackman. Who am I thinking of? He looks like it. He’s the British guy.

Claire: Yeah. He’s Hugh Jackman-esque.

Joy: Rupert Everett. Okay, Rupert Everett. I stand really corrected. Okay. But anyway, we could talk movies all day long. I’m going to do one more just so we can move on from this. But huge fan of the HBO Max series Barry that is co-written by Bill Hader. We all love Bill Hader. It is amazing, amazing show. Just watch it. You can immediately get into it. I don’t hang in for many shows, except for Severance. That is one show that I am glad I hung in with. The only reason I did is because Busy Philipps on her podcast, Busy Philipps is Doig Her Best, she is a big content slob. She doesn’t just watch anything. And she was like, “Severance is the best show on TV.” I was like, well damn it, I need to go back and watch Severance now. Because I really trust her judgement. Anyway. She is correct. It is the best show on TV. Barry, the character that plays NoHo Hank, Anthony Carrigan, can’t even. If you just want to laugh, it is a very dark comedy. But his character is un-freaking-believable. I get so excited when people create characters that you’re just like, oh my gosh, where did that come from? They are so likable. Even in this very dark comedy, he cracks me up. So great. So great. Alright, that got me very excited about shows.

Claire: I just love that. I’m trying to think – as you guys know, I don’t watch a lot of TV or a lot of shows or a lot of movies that aren’t like kids, just for lack of time. So also my examples are from long ago. From ten years ago or longer. I’m just trying to think. The last series I really watched from start to finish was 30 Rock, which I don’t think there’s been a new – I think the last season of 30 Rock was in 2013?

Joy: Yeah, but the page character. What’s his name?

Claire: Kenneth.

Joy: Yeah, Kenneth. Unbelievable.

Claire: Oh, he’s like a main character.

Joy: Really? Okay.

Claire: Because it’s such a long running sitcom, there’s a lot of main characters.

Joy: That’s true. That’s very true.

Claire: But every time I rewatch it, I have a different favorite character. I think that Alec Baldwin’s mom in that one could really qualify as a solid overlooked character.

Joy: We could go off on different episodes of Arrested Development even.

Claire: Oh my gosh. And every season of Arrested Development.

Joy: The guy whose eyebrows keep falling off.

Claire: Lucille 2.

Joy: Lucille 2. [laughing]

Claire: Her vertigo, that was just the most genius stroke of character.

Joy: Remember when they fixed her kitchen and they moved it?

Claire: Yeah, she kept running into the island. Or what about Julia Louis-Dreyfus’ character who was the blind judge who just pretended to be blind.

Joy: Yes.

Claire: And then her dog is actually blind. Spoiler alert, in case you haven’t seen Arrested Development. So good.

Joy: Oh my gosh, that show is so good. It’s so good. Okay, well speaking of shows, let me just do a quick preface to the next two weeks. Claire and I, we’ve got a lot going on in the month of May. We are going to do the next two weeks after this episode airs, we are doing two episodes with our friends, Tina DeGraff and JK McLeod. Next week will be Tina. The week after will be JK. And we just wanted to catch up with some friends because we can’t pre-record a batch of episodes. Even though we record every single week, for Claire and I to do multiple episodes in a week, it would just get really boring. We’re at our best with once a week. We don’t have that much content. We could probably do it if we had – anyway. So we are doing a chat with friends for the next couple of weeks. Please listen to those episodes. We do get into it with Tina around Selling Sunset. We talk about body image and body standards. It’s a really good discussion. And it really is more of a chat with us with our friends. It’s not so much an interview style. But we’re just kind of talking with another person because we think other people are interesting too. So listen to those episodes in the coming weeks because I have a lot to say about Selling Sunset.

Claire: My friend Elizabeth today was telling me that she watched the whole season of Selling Sunset this weekend because she was sick and she was like, “I don’t think I’ve ever in my life sat in bed and watched a whole season of anything on my phone.” Then she said her husband asked what she was watching and she was like, “Oh, it’s a real estate show.” And he’s like, “This is not a real estate show. You’re not learning real estate investing.”

Joy: Oh yeah. And there wasn’t as much real estate in this past season, which the love of the show is the houses are so beautiful. It really is amazing to watch these houses. But you get everything. You get drama. You get beautiful outfits. You get beautiful people. You have LA. The B-roll of LA. Any show that has a B-roll of Los Angeles, I’m in. You got me. I don’t need anything else. This season is a little less real estate and a little more Christine drama. Scott was watching this with me. I know I’ve said this before. Any time I watch a show that’s reality brainless TV, I think he gets it by now 14 years in, 15 years in of being together. But I think he used to be like, “You’re smarter than this. Why do you watch this stuff?” Because I do emotions all day long. And I cannot come home and watch something that requires a lot of emotions. Where Scott, that’s not how he operates. When I need a show, I need something I can easily tune out with. I know I’ve said that before. It’s so funny. He finally gets it. He makes fun of me less. But every once in a while, he’ll chime in. When I was watching Selling Sunset, he was like, “Is there anyone that’s really nice on this show?” I was like, no. That’s the point. Everyone is horrible.

Claire: They are all meanies.

Joy: Everyone is horrible. But the shoes. The shoes are great. Real estate is great. It’s just eye candy, and it’s so brainless. And then I got into Married at First Sight, which my friend from Montana in grad school was like, “You would love this show if you like brainless reality TV.” I did start watching it, and it’s 20 episodes long. I think it’s on Lifetime, and they just kind of need content. They could easily do that show in 5-8 episodes. But it’s actually pretty interesting. It is brainless TV. But there is this one couple that – so the premise is that they have matchmaker people evaluate hundreds and hundreds of candidates, and then they match people together, and then they get them married at first sight. Which all of their family is like, why don’t you just date? Why do you have to get married? And it’s like, because it’s reality. There’d be no fun drama if the just started dating.

Claire: Otherwise, it’s just a dating app.

Joy: Exactly.

Claire: Now you’re just on eHarmony.

Joy: Exactly. So there’s this couple. I think it’s Zach and Megan maybe. She’s all in, but he’s one of those guys that’s very good looking and he knows it. Way too into his looks type of thing. Washboard abs. Very tan. But seems like a down to earth guy, but he’s really not. And the whole time, he’s definitely not into it. But he keeps saying things like, he’s like, “I’m just not attracted to her yet.” Very much trying to talk himself into it. I’m like, did you not know what show you signed up for, dude?

Claire: He’s acting like he thinks he’s on The Bachelor.

Joy: Yeah. And he’s still in it. It’s almost like he’s playing it up for the cameras because he knows that he’s going to look like a total asshole because he’s like, “I’m just not attracted to her. Peace, I’m out. I’m not staying here for eight more weeks.” But you can tell he’s just trying to drag it out for eight weeks to just stay on the show, and it’s so intriguing to watch. All the matchmaker people give him the side eye where they are like, what did you just say? Do you understand what show you’re on, dude? So that’s a little entertaining.

Claire: So he’s married to her but not attracted to her?

Joy: Yeah.

Claire: So they are already married.

Joy: Yeah, they get married.

Claire: And everyone is like, you don’t just get to give it a couple more weeks. You’re going to stay married.

Joy: Yeah. After they get married, they live together and go through this whole thing of getting to know each other. So they are supposed to put them up in this apartment where they live together in neutral space for eight weeks. And then he chose not to live there. He’s like, no, I’m going to go live at my house. We’re like, that’s not the point of this show.

Claire: So he’s just trying to become TikTok famous?

Joy: He’s trying to be TikTok famous with his washboard abs. Oh, it’s so funny to watch. Because everything that comes out of his mouth, we’re like, buddy, we ain’t buying it. Bail. Cut your losses.

Claire: I think you did not understand what you were signing up for.

Joy: It’s way too much that we just talked about Married at First Sight. Whatever. Wherever we’re going with this, you’re going to be going to Mexico. You’re going surfing.

Claire: My surf trip is coming up not this weekend, but I leave next weekend. Which is crazy. Crazy. I’m going to be gone when you listen to our episode with Tina. I’m going to be in Mexico full of tacos and ocean water from swallowing so much water while I try not to drown.

Joy: Tina was really worried about you. She’s like, “Don’t even eat ice, Claire.”

Claire: She’s like, “Do not eat the ice. Do not open your mouth in the shower. Do not pull a Sex in the City movie.” And that could really happen to me. I have a sensitive system. Last thing you want –

Joy: Charlotte opens her mouth and then she gets diarrhea. [laughing]

Claire: The last thing you want is diarrhea instantly to hit you while you’re sitting on a surfboard in the ocean in your wet suit. What do you do in that scenario?

Joy: You just got to let it happen.

Claire: In your wet suit?

Joy: What else are you going to do? Take the wet suit off? It would take you two hours to take it off in the water.

Claire: That’s the problem. In the water, you can’t.

Joy: It’s happening. It’s happening.

Claire: Oh my gosh. I can’t imagine that. It’s not going to happen.

Joy: No, it’s not.

Claire: I’ve been to Mexico plenty of times and I’ve never gotten sick. It’s going to be fine.

Joy: I was going to say, aren’t there pills or antibiotics you can take as a precaution with you? Maybe?

Claire: I don’t know. I don’t think so. Who knows? I’m mostly worried about getting Covid while I’m down there because you don’t have to wear a mask on planes anymore, which is disgusting. I don’t think I’m ever going to travel without a mask again. Planes have always been disgusting. I don’t even care if Covid had never been invented. I wish that masks had always and would always be required on planes.

Joy: Always.

Claire: I don’t want to breathe stranger air.

Joy: People are so gross. Let’s argue that there has been articles that I can’t quote off the top of my head, but I have seen articles where they’re like, actually cabin air is really great because they have these great filters and it just circulates – I don’t care. We are in an enclosed space with strangers that are disgusting.

Claire: This is recycled air.

Joy: Yeah.

Claire: And the person in front of me is sneezing and farting at the same time.

Joy: So gross.

Claire: Stop.

Joy: People are so gross.

Claire: So I will still be wearing an N95 on the plane. That’s what I’m more worried about. You don’t need a test to go into Mexico, but you need a test to get back into the States. And then we’re moving. So it’s just a lot in the next couple of weeks. If I get stuck in Mexico and can’t come home to move, it’s going to be a problem.

Joy: Tell Brandon to call me. Do you know that Brandon is your handler when you’re not awake to record? Do you know that?

Claire: That he texts you and is like, “Claire is still asleep. She might be late.” Yeah, I did know that.

Joy: It’s really cute. And there’s been a handful of times where he somehow sees it on our shared calendar. He’ll be texting me like, “Joy, I know you’re supposed to record in 5 minutes, but Claire is still sleeping.” Every time, you get up and you’re there.

Claire: I rally.

Joy: But it’s almost funny. How does he not know after all these years that you always are up and there? He still will text me like, “I don’t think she’s going to make it today.”

Claire: Aw, Brandon.

Joy: It’s really cute. It’s really funny. He is, he’s your handler. “I don’t think she’s going to make it, Joy.”

Claire: The calendar says 8 o’clock. It’s 7:57. She’s still in bed.

Joy: But imagine, you always make it on time.

Claire: Then whenever we were recording with Tina, I was down to the wire. And then my Zoom restarted.

Joy: Yeah.

Claire: This is a problem.

Joy: He used to think you had a migraine.

Claire: I did have a migraine.

Joy: So then I just waited a beat. I think I actually missed his first text because I was signing on. And then he was like, “Never mind, she’s up.”

Claire: Here she is. Have I ever just flat out missed? I think I’ve missed one. Maybe one time we were recording – I want to say we were even re wording with someone else, and I just completely missed it.

Joy: I don’t know. I can’t remember. And if it was, it was because you were out of the house gone. It wasn’t like you were at home and just forgot. You were out of the house doing something and maybe swapped calendars. But I don’t remember it.

Claire: Anyway.

Joy: So traveling a lot. And if you don’t come back, tell Brandon he can call me, and I can help move your stuff. But I am going on a trip in a couple weeks. I can’t say where yet because it’s a surprise for somebody.

Claire: It’s not like a secret celebrity surprise.

Joy: Definitely not that. It’s not like, “Oh guys, I have some big news for you. Just wait.” No, it’s not like that. It’s just a surprise something that I don’t even think the people that are involved listen to this. But in the event that they do, I’m not going to say anything. So I’m traveling. And then we do think bone marrow is happening in May. So that’s still there. So there’s a lot going on in May. Then I’m going to a wedding in June. I’m going to be in Arizona for a while. And then Cadet might graduate.

Claire: Oh yeah, Cadet. I had this great realization the other day that I’m firmly out of that phase of my life where I have to go to weddings. One of the gals on my team, she’s in her mid-20’s. She has like five weddings this summer. I’m like, oh, I remember that.

Joy: I remember that too. It was right around the two years that Scott and I were dating and getting married were like wedding, wedding, wedding. We went to so many weddings in one summer. But this is my cousin. My mom is the oldest of five, so it’s the youngest brother’s son. That’s why we’re so different in age. But he’s getting married. It will be fun because it’s a rare occasion now because all the cousins and kids are grown. There’s not many opportunities for people to go to weddings and have all our family together.

Claire: That is fun.

Joy: It will be really nice. We’re really excited.

Claire: Cool. Okay, so this past weekend, Miles had a karate tournament on Saturday. And I wanted to talk about it because I feel like this might be a shared experience with other parents who are listening. Or anyone really who has a kid in their life who they are in a position of caretaking or mentoring. Prior to the tournament, I had no idea what to expect. This is Miles’ first real tournament. We had done one internal tournament with just his karate school because it was still kind of in Covid. So it was really more of, here is how you run it through, and you do your thing and you do your form and then you leave. This was the first time that Miles had participated in a tournament where kids from other karate schools were there. So I had no idea what to expect. Let me paint this picture. Eight months ago before Miles started karate, we wouldn’t have been able to even get him into a karate uniform. The pants would have been too stiff. His first class, he went out on the mat and he immediately started crying because he was so embarrassed and so overwhelmed. It has taken him an incredible amount of work to get to the point that he is at. We take him to every single class that we can, so he ends up going sometimes four or five times a week. It’s billed. You can kind of go unlimited. Unlimited is a strong word because it’s also divided by your belt level. So we take him as much as we can because he has to have the exposure. It has to be part of his routine because otherwise he will overthink it and he will freak himself out. There have been days – even still, we will have days where if something goes wrong during class, he will just melt down. His range of tolerance for adversity is even smaller than most other six-year-olds that I know. To where his range of acceptable emotions is very small, and it’s been getting so much bigger, and I really that is in huge part due to him being in karate where he can have this very safe container in which to have these experiences where he messes up or he gets something wrong in front of people or he gets called out for not paying attention or doing something that he wasn’t supposed to be doing. Then can turn around and still be accepted and a part of the group. So him going to this tournament was a really big deal. And I also had no idea how he was going to react. Because I thought we are going to get into this high school gym completely full of strangers, and he is going to freak out. So I had him literally practice his form. So form is like a routine. It’s like a karate name for a routine. Every belt has one or a couple of routines that go with it. I literally had him practice his form almost 200 times.

Joy: Woah. At home?

Claire: At home. Over the past three weeks.

Joy: Wow.

Claire: Because I just knew when he got there, he was going to be so freaked out that if he didn’t have this completely muscle memory memorized, it was not going to happen.

Joy: Yeah. So how did you break it up? Just out of curiosity.

Claire: Every time he practiced one, he would earn one minute of iPad time.

Joy: Oh. That’s genius.

Claire: He’s still only a high orange belt, which is pretty low in the ranks. So the form itself only takes a minute. So for every time you do your form, you get a minute of iPad time. So at night, he would do 10 or 15, and then he would get 10 or 15 minutes of iPad time.

Joy: Perfect. Oh my gosh, that’s genius.

Claire: It worked out great. Because we don’t do a lot of iPad time for him. So he gets there. And again, I don’t know what I was expecting. But I was texting Jess and Joy, and I was like, okay, what do you do when you are in a situation where your kid is so psyched, so hopped up on the tournament juice, thinks he is going to win first place, and you think there’s a chance he’s not even going to place.

Joy: You were pretty confident. I think your exact words were, “I’m pretty confident he’s not even getting close.”

Claire: I have no idea what to expect. I’m afraid he’s going to freak out. I have been watching him practice this so many times, and I know where it’s at. It’s not performance ready in my mind. He’s six. He’s doing great, but it’s not sharp, crisp.

Joy: If you’re sitting there watching these other kids and it’s a tournament, you’re like, surely there’s someone here who is a karate kid.

Claire: I mean, I’m like Monica from Cheer watching people like, that stance could have been a little deeper. But I don’t know. I don’t know if that’s how they judge six-year-olds.

Joy: You don’t know if Monica is there.

Claire: Monica could be there. Miles is not going to make mat. So I’m texting Jess and Joy and I’m like, what do we do with this situation? Because it feels very counterintuitive – and not even counterintuitive. It feels like there’s two extremes that you’re trying to communicate at the same time.

Joy: One is like, yes, you’re going to do it.

Claire: You’re doing great. You’re going to kill it. You’re going to be awesome. And the other one is like, it’s okay if you just get out there and your brain falls out.

Joy: Do your best.

Claire: Yeah, do your best. All that matters is that you do your best. But if something happens, that’s okay too. And winning is not important. Unless you win, in which case good job. Don’t get your hopes up, but it’s okay to be excited. I think a lot of us as kids really got one or the other. Either our parents really pressured us into if you don’t win, then you suck. Or the opposite, which you were saying, your parents never getting excited about anything you did because they didn’t want to get your hopes up.

Joy: Yeah, my mom did not want me to be disappointed. My whole career of sports in junior high and high school was cheer and dance. Any time there was a tryout. And it frustrated me to no end. My aunt would always be like, “You’re going to get it. You’re totally going to get it.” And my mom would always be like, “Well, you know, just don’t be disappointed.” She would always say something like, “Well, you just never know. Just don’t get your hopes up.” Because if she would have said, “You’re going to get it” and I didn’t get it, she never wanted us to be disappointed. But it’s worse. Because either way it’s overconfidence and that parent who is a pro athlete kind of parent that’s like, “You have to be the very best or nothing.” It’s such a weird thing to deal with.

Claire: I just talked to Miles beforehand the days leading up to it saying, you’ve practiced a lot, but we don’t know how much the other kids have practiced. Maybe someone else has practiced 300 times. And maybe there’s another kid out there that’s a little older than you. So I tried to prep him for it. So if you are someone out there who has a lot of experience with having kids in competitive things, especially mediocre kids. I don’t want to hear from people who are like, oh yeah –

Joy: My all-star athlete.

Claire: My all-star athlete. I just want to hear how do you prep your mediocre kid. Which is fine.

Joy: Give them the confidence.

Claire: Right. But then still make it seem like a big deal when the do win, but you don’t’ want to overly get excited when they win because you don’t want them to think that’s expected or that you wouldn’t have been excited if they didn’t win. Do you see what I mean? There’s just a lot going on here. Am I overthinking this?

Joy: No. Because there’s so many things going on here, and I don’t know which way to go.

Claire: It’s very complex. In the end, he did win.

Joy: Which is amazing. He looked so excited.

Claire: He was so excited. Here’s what I’m going to be honest about. I hope that no one else who ever goes to karate with Miles hears this. And how would they know. But it had less to do with him being totally dialed and more to do with the other kids being really less dialed.

Joy: They didn’t get the iPad equation.

Claire: They didn’t get the 200 minutes of iPad time.

Joy: They didn’t put in the 10,000 hours.

Claire: You know. Their mom’s not a crazy person. Now, not to make another Cheer reference, but am I turning into Gabi’s mom?

Joy: Yeah. You’re turning into that momager.

Claire: Right. I don’t want to be a momager.

Joy: Yeah, you’re not a momager.

Claire: Anyways, so he did win. He did so great. He was so, so excited. It was a small group of people. He won over like 10 other kids.

Joy: I love how you’re like, it’s less that he was super dialed and more that they were not as dialed.

Claire: Half the kids got out there and just stopped halfway through their form and didn’t know what to do.

Joy: They got intimidated. It’s a lot a pressure.

Claire: When you’re six, it’s a lot to memorize. And there’s a lot of turning. They all involve a lot of turning. Turn to the left. Turn to the back. Turn back to the front. So it’s really easy to get mixed up and then all of the sudden you’re facing the back when you’re supposed to be facing the front. Oh no, where do I turn?

Joy: Yeah, I think of the ballerina class when the little girls are just turning in circles and one walks off stage.

Claire: Yeah, that was these kids. And they’re supposed to at the beginning do this whole thing where they have these little things they say. “Judges. Proudly representing my karate school. This is my name. This is my instructor.” Miles just got out there and was screaming at the top of his lungs. I wish I had taken a video. But I was so nervous for him that I didn’t take a video. So anyway. It was so cute. He did a great job. He did a better job than everyone else.

Joy: That’s so cute. I love it.

Claire: Please give me your tips. Not that we don’t think Miles is going to grow up and be a champion karate person… ninja? I don’t know. What is the noun?

Joy: He’s a ninja.

Claire: Martial artist. But I also want to know what to do if he is not.

Joy: Yeah.

Claire: How do you support your mediocre kid? Every team needs a middle of the pack.

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Claire: Okay, so another thing I wanted to talk about today as my surfing trip approaches is feeling really nervous about going on this. If you’ve been with us since our Girls Gone WOD days, I feel like you guys will probably remember me talking about always having this deep insecurity about being the slowest one in the group. That I don’t ever want to be the person who is holding up everybody on the hike. Let alone the run. Let alone the workout. I’m starting to have this creep up about this surfing trip. Even though I know that it’s supposed to be a beginner trip. And even though I know that objectively I am in okay shape. Middle of the pack.

Joy: And you’ve been working out a lot.

Claire: I’ve been working out a lot. And I’ve been doing my little renegade rows. I’ve been doing my chest flies. And my dumbbell rows.

Joy: Getting that core stability so you can just hop up on that board.

Claire: I’ve been doing my Russian twists. I’ve been doing my toes to bar, my knee raises I should say. I have been trying hard. And I’ve been doing my 200 minutes of iPad time. I think that there can be a perception for when people do things like this. You take a big trip or you sign up for a big race that you feel completely confident about it or that the emotion you’re having is just excitement and being psyched. But I’m also so nervous. It reminds me of when I did my NOLS trip that I talk about a lot. If you guys don’t know what NOLS is, it stands for National Outdoor Leadership School. It’s like Outward Bound if you know what Outward Bound is. I did this month-long backpacking and canoeing trip in the Yukon when I was in college. It turned out to be one of the single most influential experiences of my life. But I cried on the plane on the way there because I was so freaked out. And then when I went to Argentina to study abroad, I threw up on the plane because I was so nervous.

Joy: Seriously?

Claire: Yeah. I had never done anything like that before. And I had to go and speak Spanish. I had never been to another country completely by myself before.

Joy: Yeah, that is scary. Sometimes I look back and when I moved to France for three months and I was 21. How the hell did I have the balls to do that?

Claire: You just didn’t know any better.

Joy: And we didn’t have phones. I couldn’t communicate with my parents, with anybody unless they called the house I was staying at. Oh my gosh, how did I get around? How did I get to Lille? I don’t know. How did I get there?

Claire: When I went to Argentina, their international airport and their regional national airport are not the same airport. You fly into one airport, you get on a bus to another complete airport on the other side of Buenos Aires, and get on another plane. How did I figure that out without a phone?

Joy: Exact same thing. How did I even get to the school? How did the person find me to take me to my host family’s house? How did I do anything? How did I figure out the train? It’s crazy to me. We’re dinosaurs.

Claire: You just gave yourself a lot more time.

Joy: Yes. But as far as emotionally, I understand why you’re nervous. That feeling jumping into something so wildly unknown is a lot.

Claire: Yeah. And that I’m going to be in a group and they all are here to do this athletic thing.

Joy: Do you know how many people?

Claire: I don’t think it’s very big. I think it’s only five or six.

Joy: That’s good. That’s good.

Claire: Except the other main activity is yoga. They’re going to make me do yoga every day.

Joy: You’ve done yoga before. We did yoga in Costa Rica.

Claire: I know, but only one time. And there were monkeys.

Joy: There were monkeys. Which looking back is so great.

Claire: So great. I do yoga occasionally. It’s not like I’ve never done yoga. I get roped into a yoga class probably 2-6 times a year. It’s fine. But I don’t know. These are the thoughts that come into my head when I start to worry about it. I bought a wetsuit. What if I get there and they laugh at my wetsuit? Because I don’t know these things. I live in Colorado. What if I get really sunburned? And I want to wear a hat when I’m surfing, and what if they laugh at me because I want to wear a hat. These are the things I’m worried about being judged for. I’m a grown-ass woman and I worry about these things. So I just wanted to say them out loud. Because not only does it make them feel silly – now, I’m like, okay Claire, you don’t need to worry about other people laughing at you for wearing a hat. You can wear a hat.

Joy: You can absolutely wear a hat.

Claire: Even if it gets washed away in the ocean. Maybe bring a couple hats.

Joy: As long as you don’t show up wearing jeans, I think you’re fine.

Claire: I mean, let’s hope so.

Joy: It’s so hot there is what I’m saying.

Claire: Wow, let’s talk about jeans. I was going to pack jeans. Should I not pack jeans? What are you saying?

Joy: I think only Colorado people get this joke. The joke around “Trump skis in jeans.” Yeah, three’s a bumper sticker. Colorado people get it, “Trump skis in jeans.” I showed it to one of my friends in Arizona and she was like, “I don’t get it.” I was like, oh, you don’t understand that you don’t ski in jeans.

Claire: Right. So do you remember a couple months ago. We did a Q&A on Instagram, and they asked a question, what do you wear your first day of skiing. I was very specific. Here’s what you wear. Pants go over the top of your boots. Your gloves go inside your coat. You don’t have to wear a hat under your helmet. You can just wear a helmet. Here are the things you need to know to not look like a dummy. Don’t carry your skis on your shoulder. Don’t try to hold it like a bundle of firewood. But those are the things that you wouldn’t know. That’s the position that I’m getting myself into of knowing that I’m going to do something that looks dumb. Which is okay. Looking dumb is fine.

Joy: Now that you say that, there’s plenty of times that we’ve gone to Hawaii over the course of our lifetime when we were going to Hawaii so much, I think that there’s been plenty of times when I have not signed up for something because I’m worried about being judged and being the tourist. Like paddle boarding with a group. I’m like, I just want to go paddle board by myself. But even then, I’ll get embarrassed going over to paddle board. I have a weird fear of looking like a tourist. I think that’s another piece of you going into something so unknown and learning something so new. Brene Brown talks about this a lot. She does not like to be a beginner at something. The learning is such a vulnerable place where you have to make mistakes and you have to be coached, all that stuff. But it’s beginner, so I’m assuming everyone in your class is in the same spot. No one is going to show up and be –

Claire: Like ripping.

Joy: Like Laird Hamilton.

Claire: If Laird Hamilton comes, I’m getting Covid and staying in Mexico.

Joy: Yeah, because he’s probably going to be with his wife Gabby Reece. Please show me your ways because they are beautiful.

Claire: In case you guys don’t know, Laird Hamilton was my very normal average high school crush. Didn’t everyone have a crush on Laird Hamilton?

Joy: It still kills me that you had posters of surfing.

Claire: This is my thing. This has been my dream. Maybe that’s why I feel nervous.

Joy: That’s fair.

Claire: This is 16-year-old Claire talking. I was obsessed. So pray for me.

Joy: Please pray.

Claire: It’s going to be great. I’m going to do great. It’s going to be wonderful, and I’m not going to eat the ice. And I’m going to wear a hat. Okay, give us a quick update on Joe.

Joy: I can’t wait to hear how it goes. Joe is doing very well. He is growing like crazy. We just had his first appointment at the vet. Puppies get a series of shots to make sure they have all their vaccines. You have to do it in certain increments, so he had his second round of shots with us. He weighed in at almost 21 pounds. When we got him, he was 11 pounds. So in three weeks he doubled his weight. And he’s so good. He’s just a very chill – nothing has really changed about his personality. He’s a very chill, sweet dog. It’s so fun to see puppies mature. I know I’ve said this before. Every week you have a different dog because they change so fast. So just this past weekend, I was taking him on a walk. And normally we go on very short walks because he’s scared and really nervous. And this time, I have a 20-minute loop I take JT on, and he did the whole loop with us. He did great, and he was so good. He was looking up at me and giving me eye contact. Normally he would do starts and stops. He would stop and look around, take in all the noises, and then he’d start again, but then he’d stop, take a look around, take in all the noises. And now he’s just going, so that’s cool to see because his confidence is building. And very selfishly it makes my life easier because then I don’t have to take two separate walks a day of taking JT and then taking Joe and then taking JT. So that’s been really fun. He did his first puppy class a couple weeks ago. He did great. People always ask me who watches your dogs when you travel. Most of the time we have people in our Canine Companions family watch because they know the commands, they know how to handle these dogs. And especially with puppies, you want to keep the training consistent. Even though we’re not going to be gone that long, it’s just easier. So people who are in the Canine Companions family watch these dogs. So yeah, he’s doing really well.

Claire: Yay Joe. And is JT still doing well?

Joy: Yeah, they’re actually getting along better. Not that they were ever not getting along. But at first, JT was avoidant. He just avoided him. He wasn’t interested. Joe would come up to him, and JT would just kind of run away. Not in a scared way. He would just be like, I don’t want anything to do with this. So he would go away. Now it’s really cute because they’ve hit their groove and they play all the time. After breakfast and dinner every day, they just play for like an hour. JT is like a little puppy again. His inner puppy is awoken and it’s just adorable.

Claire: And when do you hear about Cadet?

Joy: When this episode releases, we will probably have heard her most recent report. It will come out on April 27. So that will just mean that they’ll give us a report like, yes, she is still in the hearing dog program, she’s doing great. From what I’ve heard people in the Canine Companions family, the hearing dog program might take a little bit longer – meaning if she was in the typical service dog track, she would be graduating in May because it’s only about 5-6 months of training. But my understanding of the hearing dog track, they may be a little bit longer. So it’s probably more likely that she’ll graduate end of May or maybe June. So we’re just kind of waiting. The weird part is we just have to go on with our lives and pray that we don’t have a conflict. Please don’t have graduation the same weekend as this wedding in Arizona. Because we really want to be there and do the whole ceremony with her. But if she does graduate, in case I haven’t mentioned this, we would fly out and meet the recipient. They have this really beautiful ceremony where the puppy raisers hand the leash over to the new recipient and everyone meets and cries. It’s really, really sweet. It would be amazing to see her. Also looking back, how hard it was to even talk about letting her go. It’s been really healing to have Joe. It doesn’t hurt as much not having her, which I never thought I’d get to. We miss her a lot. There’s so much that we miss about her. But this is what I think about too. I think about when I lose JT. It’s a very weird thing to think about. Oh, you will move on from loss. It will still hurt. You’ll still miss someone. I’m not even comparing this to humans obviously. But when JT passes away, I think that was one thing that we really wanted to puppy raise because we wanted to have more dog energy in the house, and we didn’t want to have all our love poured into JT. Because honest to goodness, I don’t know if we would have survived when JT passes away. But if he would have passed away while we were raising another dog. That was our thinking in a very odd way. And also, we wanted to puppy raise. That’s not the only reason. These are the things we started to plan because we love this animal so much. In a way I laugh at that too. Brene Brown always talks about you can’t plan ahead to soften the blow of any type of pain. But what I’m saying is it really showed us that you can move on from something that hurts like that, and that was what I was so afraid of with Cadet. How much longer is this going to hurt, and how painful is this going to be? It is hard, and that’s always the number one thing that people ask when I tell them I’m a puppy raiser. I’m like, yeah, it hurts like hell. It’s the hardest thing I’ve ever done in my life. But I’m so excited to see her if we get to see her and go to her graduation. It will be so emotional, but I’m also at a point where this is what they mean when they say the dogs choose the path that they want. This is something that she enjoys. Canine Companions, they put the dogs in a place where the dog is going to thrive. They would never force a dog to become a service dog if it wasn’t showing the behaviors that it was enjoying it. If we get to see her, which I really hope we do, and get to say goodbye to her finally, it’s weird to think about. It’s been so long since we said goodbye to her. But I always think about that, if we get to see her again, what that will be like. I’m sure the emotions will flood back.

Claire: Oh yeah. I thought you were going to say that you weren’t sure if you wanted to see her again because now you’re at a point where it doesn’t hurt as bad.

Joy: No, I definitely want to see her. I think it’s just me thinking about this whole process in getting a new puppy was, oh, I get it now. I get how people can move on and let go of these dogs, and then you open up your heart to another one and you see what good it does for others. Anyway. It’s a lot.

Claire: Not to just talk about things that traumatized you in the past year… [laughing] How is that for a bridge into another topic? On Instagram stories you posted about how you’re coming up on the year anniversary of leaving your job last year and how you were trying to decide how to honor that day. But also trying to decide if you’re going to share more of what happened. This is not the moment. We’re not going to drop this bomb two minutes before the episode ends, but do you want to talk a little bit about how that thought process has evolved for you?

Joy: Yeah.

Claire: I know we get into this a little bit on the episode with Tina.

Joy: We do a tiny bit with Tina when we talk. Next week’s episode we talk a little bit about this because Tina and I had a very similar experience. Here is what I’m going to say about it for now. Right now, I’m in a really good place. I’ve been in a really good place. I’m so glad that things worked out the way they did. And there would be twinges of moments, especially because the year mark of me leaving that job is coming up at the end of May. I’ll still have dreams and moments where I’m so angry. But the funny thing is, I haven’t really been as angry. Ever since I did that post, it’s like every time I talk a little bit about it, it releases something. I think the reason why I hesitate about talking exactly about what happened is because it brings out a part of me that’s gossipy and not helpful. I think that’s where I go back and forth. If I talk about what really happened, I go to a place of anger, bitterness, and mean girls, which is what I left. That’s the reason why I’m no longer there. And do I really want to talk about a place that if I talk about exactly what happened it sucks me back into the whole drama of what happened, which was really horrible, you guys. It was a horrible situation. Someone DM’d me when I did that post. If you didn’t see it, I just posted something on stories. It’s basically like, “It’s coming up on the year. I’ve been reflecting a lot. Kind of debating on how I want to honor that day because it is a big day for me emotionally. And if I ever want to tell the full story.” And someone DM’d and said, I went through something similar. And what I came around to if I wanted to share that “full story” was if it’s helpful or if it’s hurtful. If it’s helpful, then share it. But if it feels hurtful, then don’t share it. That’s a great way to think about it because I don’t want to be what I feel like that organization did to me. And I truly feel like they were horrible to me. And by me talking about it in that way is me being horrible to them, and that doesn’t feel good to me. However, I want to at some point perhaps share the experience. And I haven’t figured that out. It’s taken this long for me to even share some details, and every time I talk about it, I feel like I’m super vague. There’s a reason behind that. There was so much pain and bitterness and anger that sharing the story turns it into this gossipy muckily muck of me just being mad at women specifically. That’s the hard part too. Women, people who I thought were my friends, that I really felt betrayed by. So if I get to a point of saying this is exactly what happened, how is that going to be helpful? But perhaps how it’s helpful is how I came around to it and healed my heart. The pain that’s there. Truly I’m in such a better place. I work for the most amazing organization. I have such a great balance in my life. I cannot overstate the thing of “things happen for a reason.” As much as I hate hearing that, it’s so true. It really is true. But there’s a part of me that also when I think about that, I think the bitterness that’s there is if I say, “I’m in such a good place now” that that gives them permission to say, “We’re glad she’s not here anymore.” The other thing I’ll be honest about if I were to talk about it, honestly – and this is how I know I’m not ready to share everything – is my hope is that they listen to it. And that’s something that tells me, you’re just in it to be mean. If I talk about it, my hope is like, yeah, I hope these bitches hear it. And I’m like, yeah, that’s hurtful. You’re not ready then, if you’re going to share that piece. But if I want to get to a spot where it’s helpful, then maybe I will. So all I can say right now is I’ve had to protect my energy and sharing with people who I feel like are going to help me through it. I kept in touch with some people who I used to work with who really wanted to talk about the drama. Every time I would meet with them, it was kind of like, oh, this makes me feel worse. I don’t want to talk about the drama. I want to talk about how much hurt I’m feeling and how this is a hard thing to go through. Not so-and-so is a jerk. I can’t believe they blah blah blah. On some level, I get that that’s a little bit healing with a certain few that are protected. But more importantly, I spend the year really, really, really backing off and really healing and really recognizing. Like oh wow, you are in a very bad place. They were not nice, and you do not need to be at a place like that anymore. Getting there took some time. And here’s the thing, guys. I’m going to say this part because I think it’s important for people to understand. I did not leave my job. I want to say that because I don’t want it to sound like it was this luxury decision. We’ve talked about that before. In some situations, if you have the luxury to leave, that’s a luxury position. Not everyone gets that privileged position to be like, I’m going to choose to leave my job because I’ve saved up all this money or am in a financial place to do it. I did not leave.

Claire: You were, more or less, not given a choice.

Joy: Yes. It was a reorganization, and I was not asked to return. We were all fired – it’s a long story. But if you’ve ever been in a reorg, basically they fire everybody and then they rehire you into new positions. I was very much believing, zero doubt, which is why it was such a shock, I had 1010% confidence that I was going to be rehired because I was one of the top performers on that team. And so when I was not rehired, that was where all of this came out of the blue. So I want to be transparent about that piece because I want people to understand that this was not a decision that I decided to leave. I’m okay saying that now because it’s almost been a year. I had some fear even talking about this on the podcast because I have fear that the company can be very… what’s the word?

Claire: Litigious.

Joy: Yeah. And they can be vindictive and a little bit like… they can come after you. So because it’s been so far away, I don’t worry about that anymore. That’s why I was like, “I just decided to leave” because I really wanted it to be a very vague. I didn’t want anything negative. Even Scott was like, “Don’t you dare breath a word of negativity because they will come after you.” I truly believed that with how horrible they were to me. That is one piece that I do want to be honest about because I don’t want people to get this idea that I just left because it was so negative. Yes, and there is more to it that at some point perhaps if it’s helpful I can talk about. I was really quickly kicked out within two days of notice. You can imagine me managing a team of 30 amazing people how shocking that can be to not even be able to say goodbye to your team and how traumatic that was. So more on that as I can learn to talk about it in a way that’s helpful. And perhaps what I would like the listeners to do is ask questions of what might be helpful for you. If you have gone through something similar or if you’re in a place of transition in your life. Because on a bigger scale, that’s what it was was huge transitions. Happy to talk about it in a way that’s helpful. Questions might be a great way for me to formulate how to do that.

Claire: Okay. So speaking of questions, we do have some random silly questions. So we are just going to lighten the air a little bit before we end this episode. This is a question that I want to start with because I think it’s going to be hard for you to answer.

Joy: Oh no.

Claire: Would you rather be a dog or a celebrity for a week?

Joy: [deep breath] A celebrity. And the reason –

Claire: What if you were a celebrity’s dog?

Joy: I say celebrity. I think of all the juices I can drink.

Claire: That’s true. If you were a dog, you would only get to eat one thing all week.

Joy: So that’s the reason.

Claire: Because of more varied food and beverages. I respect that logic. I definitely would pick celebrity. Favorite place you’ve ever traveled and one place on your bucket list you’ve never been?

Joy: Favorite place. I think we just talked about this. Iceland for sure is my favorite. It’s a tossup. I loved Costa Rica too. But I would say Iceland. And then on the bucket list, I know this sounds really silly, but Scott and I really want to go to New Orleans. We’ve yet to go to New Orleans.

Claire: Really? Ever in your life?

Joy: Never. Ever, ever, ever.

Claire: It’s so cute. You guys have to go. It’s so easy. Just book a trip.

Joy: It’s a very easy thing to do. So that’s one. I know I should be thinking bigger and international, but that’s truly on our bucket list.

Claire: I think one of my favorite places I’ve ever been is definitely Iceland and Argentina. A place that’s on my bucket list right now is to go to Banff. Okay, we’re just going to do a couple quick ones. Some of these are a little longer, so we’ll come back to them later. A workout class you tried but hated? For example, belly dancing. Pole dancing, I hated. I thought I would love it because it’s sort of silly and I love to dance. I hated it. It was so sticky. Everything about it was sticky.

Joy: Did you have to wear the high heels too?

Claire: No. You’ve got to bring your own high heels.

Joy: I was going to say, I can’t imagine.

Claire: My skin didn’t adapt. I don’t know. I don’t know if there was a cream we were supposed to use.

Joy: Lube. Do you bring your own lube?

Claire: I feel like that would be counterproductive. There’s got to be something in between skin on metal.

Joy: Sticky, versus slippy.

Claire: Like chalk maybe? I don’t know.

Joy: You just bring your bag of chalk. The first thing that came to my mind, it wasn’t a class that I didn’t enjoy. That didn’t come to mind for a fitness class. But there was one instructor that I took a yoga class ages ago. I’m thinking like 15 years ago where every time he would talk about doing a pose… maybe I need to release the video because there is no way for me explain this over the audio waves. But he would try to explain the move with his hands. And when he’s hit the end of the pose, he would go [clicking sound]. So almost like, “Warrior pose… [click]” He would just go, “And… [click]” It drove me crazy. [laughing]

Claire: We don’t need sound effects. This is yoga.

Joy: Every move. So he wasn’t explaining the move. He was doing the move and ending it with that sound. I was like, I can’t do this. I almost ran out of the class, yeah.

Claire: That’s annoying. Okay, first thing that comes to your mind. Ready? Don’t overthink this. Best dessert you’ve ever had?

Joy: Cheesecake at the Cheesecake Factory.

Claire: Oh wow, hot take. I think one time I accidentally ordered an entire chocolate volcano cake in Argentina. Have I told this story?

Joy: No.

Claire: So after I graduated, I more or less did a study abroad. I didn’t study abroad when I was actually in college. So for a couple months, I lived in Argentina. I lived with a host family, and I went to an English school. One thing that I found was very difficult was that my vocabulary limitations were incredibly obvious when I was reading a menu. I had no idea what any of the words were. Not only is Argentina a very regional type of cuisine, but I just didn’t know that many food words. I hadn’t learned them. The only words – carne, okay great. I get some sort of meat thing. Which one time I accidentally ordered an entire eight person smoked meat platter. The other one that I would always recognize was hongos which means mushrooms. Okay, this is going to be something savory. One time I was at a restaurant and I had no idea. None of these items looked familiar. So I just picked the last thing on the menu. It turned out to be a full-size chocolate lava cake.

Joy: [laughing] That’s amazing.

Claire: And I ordered it with such confidence, the waiter was like, okay. The word “chocolate” I would have recognized, so it must have been called something different. It came out and it was a full-size chocolate lava cake. It was by far not the worst mistake I’ve made in Spanish.

Joy: Oh my gosh.

Claire: This person says, “Not random. But suggestions for wide toe box running shoes brands, please.”

Joy: Oh, HOKAs, no doubt.

Claire: Or Altra.

Joy: HOKAs, Altra. Or Brooks.

Claire: Great, let’s do two more. This is a quick one. When are you guys coming over to TikTok with your reels? The answer is never.

Joy: Ever.

Claire: Sorry. Never going to happen.

Joy: I hate TikTok, and I refuse. But I bet you one day we will, and this is going to be like…

Claire: Never ever.

Joy: I just can’t get into it.

Claire: Favorite spring flower?

Joy: Tulips are great. I have a million tulips.

Claire: Tulips are great. Perfect. My favorite spring flower is lilacs.

Joy: Okay.

Claire: Last one. What is your favorite thing about one another? That’s a cute question.

Joy: Off the top of my head, because there’s a lot. But the number one thing is how quick-witted you are with things. You always make me laugh. The things that come out of your mouth – and Brandon always says this too. I think the thing I loved the most, especially when we were traveling with Brandon and Scott, I loved when Brandon would just start laughing at you. He’d be like, “Ha ha ah,” and I’d be like, oh my God, it’s so funny how he will laugh at you. And you’re like, he thinks I’m hilarious. And how funny you are but I don’t think you realize how funny you are. The things that fly out of your mouth, you’re just like, where did that come from?

Claire: Thanks.

Joy and Claire: [laughing]

Joy: And your deep knowledge of water.

Claire: Deep knowledge of absolutely random topics. Thanks, that’s so nice of you.

Joy: You’re welcome. I think someone asked this before too.

Claire: Yeah, but I think you gave a different answer. My favorite thing about you is that you absolutely do not suffer fools at all. If you’re in a conversation with Joy and she doesn’t want to be there, it is so obvious.

Joy: [laughing] Is it that obvious?

Claire: Yes, Joy. It’s obvious to me because I know what to look for. But you just do not entertain any type of putting up with people’s stupidity for the sake of politeness.

Joy: Nope. [laughing] That’s pretty true.

Claire: I appreciate that about you.

Joy: At least someone does. I’ve got to tell that to my mom. She always gets mad at me for that.

Claire: Your mom is too polite.

Joy: Because she is so patient, and I’m not. I’m exactly like my dad. I am becoming my father, but my dad, he’ll talk to you on the phone. The other day, Scott was on the phone with him. He’s like, “Yeah Ron, da da da da da.” He looks at me and he’s like, “I think your dad just hung up on me.” I’m like, oh yeah, he does that. When he’s done talking, he just hangs up. That’s going to be me. I just can’t deal with anything. Small talk, energy for stupidity, can’t. That’s really funny.

Claire: Alright guys, well thank you so much for joining us for another week. Don’t forget to check out our sponsor, Ned, helloned.com. Discount code is JOY or /JOY. Check out their Dream Set. It’s dreamy. You can find us on Instagram at @joyandclaire_. You can go to our website joyandclaire.com. Which by the time you guys hear this, the new one might be up. Go check it out. It might be. It’s so cute. And we will talk to you next week.

Joy: Bye guys.

Claire: Bye